Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player

11-24-2014 , 07:08 AM
so this weekend i ran into a player who was HYPER aggressive in a 1-3 game (300 max buy-in). supposedly he's an online pro who's on vacation and splashing around in 1-3.

this was his (winning) strategy

straddle every single hand to $6

if his straddle was unopened, he'd raise it about 90% of the time to $25-$45 (depending on how many limpers)

if checked to (or first to act) he'd c-bet close to pot 100% of the time.

he took down the vast majority of the pots uncontested.

i'm normally a tight player looking to get in to hands with better holdings against aggressive players. this guy's bet sizing was killing me though.

i never got a high-pocket pair against him. so i tried to get to flops in position with good starting hands with the plan to let him value own himself if i connected. so i'd limp-call the straddle with KJ for example. the flop would come all low and no hearts and i'd fold to the c-bet. did this about 5 times and it cost me $200.

what's the counter strategy here? seems like there is big money to take.. even if you have to ride the variance train. which ranges should be calling, which should be raising (pre and post flop)?

i can't figure it out and i just played right into his plan of raise and take. should i shove with 2 overs? should i only play high-pocket pairs?
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 07:39 AM
Where was he seated? That is the key for how you plan on playing against him. But you should only play a style of poker that you are comfortable with as well.

Generally when the table is playing loose you need to play tight .. or get a table change. You can see that since you are uncomfortable continuing past the Flop that he can play perfectly against you when you actually do see a Turn. And then you just win (some of) your own chips back when he folds out .. then he just keeps it moving forward and takes them back in the next hand.

I like to play these guys OOP. This does 2 things for you ...
1) He does your betting for you, at least on the Flop. Then you can donk the Turn when you do hit and he will start to fold out once you start showing winners down.
2) If others at the table are chasing him as well, then you can call 'his' bets getting good odds with your draws or c/r with a lot of dead money in the pot. You still have to count on him continuing, but the others will fold out to anyone else at the table showing aggression besides V.

Open the betting yourself to slow down his game. Even a min raise might let you see some Flops cheaper. You indicate in your OP that this might work ..

Play your game ... either sit on your hands or get a table change if you arent in the mood to mix it up. If you aren't a BINGO player, then dont be. Just sit back and enjoy the show and wait for your moment. If he indeed is a PRO he will notice that you haven't played in many pots and fold to your PF c/r or Turn aggresion. In a spot like this you 'only' need one hand every 3 orbits or so to have a profitable session. He is driving the hands per hour up with his aggression. He will not turn down his play until you play back at him ... c/c is not the way to go until he respects you (if possible) ... but you need to be willing to double and triple barrel into him a few times. If not in your game ... then sit and wait.

It really sucks not to have pairs or hit boards when a player like this is at the table, but don't get sucked in where you spew in spots that you normally wouldn't play a hand. GL
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 01:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by answer20
Where was he seated? That is the key for how you plan on playing against him. But you should only play a style of poker that you are comfortable with as well.

Generally when the table is playing loose you need to play tight .. or get a table change. You can see that since you are uncomfortable continuing past the Flop that he can play perfectly against you when you actually do see a Turn. And then you just win (some of) your own chips back when he folds out .. then he just keeps it moving forward and takes them back in the next hand.

I like to play these guys OOP. This does 2 things for you ...
1) He does your betting for you, at least on the Flop. Then you can donk the Turn when you do hit and he will start to fold out once you start showing winners down.
2) If others at the table are chasing him as well, then you can call 'his' bets getting good odds with your draws or c/r with a lot of dead money in the pot. You still have to count on him continuing, but the others will fold out to anyone else at the table showing aggression besides V.

Open the betting yourself to slow down his game. Even a min raise might let you see some Flops cheaper. You indicate in your OP that this might work ..

Play your game ... either sit on your hands or get a table change if you arent in the mood to mix it up. If you aren't a BINGO player, then dont be. Just sit back and enjoy the show and wait for your moment. If he indeed is a PRO he will notice that you haven't played in many pots and fold to your PF c/r or Turn aggresion. In a spot like this you 'only' need one hand every 3 orbits or so to have a profitable session. He is driving the hands per hour up with his aggression. He will not turn down his play until you play back at him ... c/c is not the way to go until he respects you (if possible) ... but you need to be willing to double and triple barrel into him a few times. If not in your game ... then sit and wait.

It really sucks not to have pairs or hit boards when a player like this is at the table, but don't get sucked in where you spew in spots that you normally wouldn't play a hand. GL
thanks for the thoughtful replies to both my posts!

i have no problem changing up my style if i can see why it's better. i'm just having trouble narrowing down my own ranges to push back at him with.

at this table i was in the 1 seat and he was in the 4 so he had position a little more than i did.

when i play i usually buy $200 extra in green chips and put them in my pocket and top off every time i'm down $25 or more so every hand i was close to max buy-in.

the big issue i was having was his extreme bet sizing. if it were even slightly smaller i could see flops with great implied odds. but since every flop took a big chunk of my stack and the flop bet was going to be almost half my starting stack... i'm not sure i'm setting myself up for positive EV. i'm thinking i have to either tighten way up to like the top 5% of hands and go into call-down mode or push back (not sure), or i have to push back lighter but i'm a little lost on where to start on determining the ranges.
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 01:14 PM
U should tighten up or at least appear tight. And when u play, never limp unless QQ+ and planning on trapping, always raise and show strength preflop. If u can read board any good, u can cbet most hands. Show him u r not afraid to play multiple streets. And yes play on position.
When u add up, size ur stack around 120. Tighten up and be ready to go to showdown. Just don't be greedy and limp every pot hoping to flop a monster. Hands that seems to win against these players at showdown are pairs with better kickers or better pairs. not strts, flushes or full houses. Either he will push the players out or he will get out on scary boards.

Last edited by dangecarlos; 11-24-2014 at 01:25 PM.
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 02:39 PM
The Villain in this thread is playing exploitative poker; he's taking advantage of the mistakes that other people are making. The Villain is playing the way he should play, given the table dynamics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by answer20
It really sucks not to have pairs or hit boards when a player like this is at the table, but don't get sucked in where you spew in spots that you normally wouldn't play a hand. GL
How could you possibly spew against this Villain? Supposedly he's playing every hand the exact same way. You could never look at your cards, call every bet, and in the long run you should break-even (except for the rake).

Your fear, of spewing, is the mistake the table is making. They fold, after the flop, when correct poker play (i.e. the math) says they shouldn't.

One more plug for Poker's 1%. It covers all this is detail.
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 04:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by au4all
The Villain in this thread is playing exploitative poker; he's taking advantage of the mistakes that other people are making. The Villain is playing the way he should play, given the table dynamics.



How could you possibly spew against this Villain? Supposedly he's playing every hand the exact same way. You could never look at your cards, call every bet, and in the long run you should break-even (except for the rake).

Your fear, of spewing, is the mistake the table is making. They fold, after the flop, when correct poker play (i.e. the math) says they shouldn't.

One more plug for Poker's 1%. It covers all this is detail.
what's the correct counter play? to raise/bet post flop? call down with A high or better?
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote
11-24-2014 , 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 85chickasaw
what's the correct counter play? to raise/bet post flop? call down with A high or better?
Get the money in with a better range than your opponent. If he's got $100+ in on the flop with 90% of hands, shove 89% of your hands. This assumes he'll never fold too. If he'll fold even a little bit, just shove 100%.

Realistically, wait for top 25%-ish hands to reduce variance* and ensure you're in spots where you're heads-up.

*Note: still LOTS of variance.
ranges to counter hyper-aggressive player Quote

      
m