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Originally Posted by Garick
No, just no. Implied Odds are not what is possible to win, it is what you will win on average if you hit.
you're confusing three different figures.
1) is the maximum we can win based on stack size. In multiway pots, you can use the average, or most likely effective stack size to evaluate this. This is your
Implied Odds
2) There are odds of making a hand with which you expect to make lots of money on average. With suited unpaired hands, those odds are around 18-20 to 1.
3) Then there is the average amount you can expect to win when you do make a big hand.
I'm not sure 2 and 3 have a name. But when someone says "Implied Odds" they mean #1
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Do you really think that if you hit your flush you will get someone to put 50BBs in with a worse hand on average?
Sometimes yes. But I don't just make flushes with my hands. I can make trips. I can make two pair. The odds of all these things combined require me to make ALOT less than 50BB's on average.
I feel like I'm repeating myself now. It's clear you aren't reading what I'm writing because you prefer to be combative. But here it is one more time.
The odds of making a big-value hand are only like 18-20 to 1. With a 0.5BB investment, we need to make 9-10BB's on average. There's already half that much in the pot.
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Just how badly are your Vs playing limped pots?
Pretty bad. I can't explain it. They must be getting terrible advice from somewhere.
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Generally speaking, if you flop a flush and manage to get big action OTF, your equity is good, but not that great. Other flushes, pair+NFD, and sets are pretty much the only hands getting much money in on monotone flops.
Oh come on.
NURSE!!?? Can we get some math over here??
What are the odds of getting overflushed with Q4s??
And everything else you mentioned has 7 outs or less. What do you call "great equity"?
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That means that 1) you have less odds to hit a flush on those hands where your Vs have a hand that could actually pay one off and 2) you'd better have a high one, it your RIOs are worse than your IOs.
Q4s would be 3rd nuts. Depending on which cards flop, it will be 1st or 2nd nuts some of the time. So, how big does our flush have to be?
And all this flush talk just ignores the other possibilities. Like we talked about A7o. You're 50 to 1 to make 2 pair. Are you really saying you can't average 25BB's in a multi-way pot with Aces-up?
Last edited by RagingOwl; 07-18-2018 at 11:07 AM.