2/5 game, hero sits with $1200 in the SB; to the right on the button is a very strong TAG reg.

UTG straddled to 10, fish in UTG +1 raises to $40, 2 callers, then BTN 3-bets to $240. Hero looks down at A3s.

Certainly a mostly fold hand, however we have several things pointing towards a potential jam:

(1) Opener's range is wide.

(2) $80 dead money from 2 callers <----- not significant in relation to a $1200 jam, but

(3) Point 2 makes BTN's 3-betting range wider than usual.

(4) We block AA.

(5) Stacks sizes are just right - big enough for decent FE without being absurdly expensive.

(6) We're suited and have wheel potential - if called we probably have as much equity as we possibly can have.

Haven't looked at spoiler yet. It's a reasonable spot but assuming the fish has a similar stack size, I'm not keen on it because fish is UTG and is allowed to be dealt hands, so I'm dodging two possible callers. That said, it can't really be awful and might be +EV. If you were going to go with the bluff, I'd probably try 4betting small, to like 550 say, which is just as committal but looks way scarier imo.

OK have looked at spoiler. Think that was best. Might go for it against super fishy fish though, like if the guy is raising to 40 every hand then I like it.

no idea what stack sizes are

Looks like a really bad spot to 4!

Nope I'd fold and move on. You need him to fold at a very high frequency to show a profit here.

$1000 deep 4-bet shoving elicits basically the exact same FE but you're risking less, 240bb is just way too much. So I don't necessarily think your stack size is perfect for a 4b bluff jam. Obv we cant choose to have $1000 here but yeah.

Yea, the fish was bad but not stupid bad; he's opening wide and has little regard for position so I wouldn't read anything into the fact that he was in EP, but he's certainly not in there with totally random hands.

As for the 4-bet bluff to 550 to look pot committed, if we are 5-bet jammed on and we have half our stack in the middle, are we not actually pot committed?

I don't know our exact equity vs. range but at that point we only need 25%, which with our suitedness and wheel potential is likely achievable. We have exactly that vs AK; KK would jam, maybe even QQ?

I think with 1200 it'd be a losing call because we'd actually need a bit more than 25% equity, but I'm not too sure about the general idea of trying to look pot committed when you're not because to look credible, that requires you to bet a size to almost be actually pot committed!

If we did have $1000 or maybe even $800 which would lay villain around 2:1 pot odds on a jam, would you consider jamming then?

The 4-bet jam is just so nuttish that I think villain would range us on at least QQ+ and AKs, maybe even AA/KK only, so 2:1 isn't superb odds for his range in this spot I don't think.

No I mean we should actually be committed. To me 550 is obviously committed, but if you're not so sure, bump it up to where you think you look committed, but where it's not super blatant (like raising to 900). The point is to make it seem like you want him to call. Unless he knows your play super well that should make a player like him more reluctant to put chips in than just jamming. Definitely would for me.

Ah, I got you.

But I think I disagree with you about the player type. Against a strong player who would know to never call here, only fold or jam, I don't think there's any sense in making a pot-committing bet that you'll have to call if jammed on. It'd be the exact same as jamming ourselves.

Against a donk though, you (1) might actually just get called, and then have the opportunity to jam the flop and hope he missed with 2 big cards and folds there, or fold yourself if he jams the flop, and (2) he might actually believe your "please call me" story and overfold pre-flop.

Still don't know anyone's stack size

Main villain OTB covers hero's $1200 stack; I missed writing that out thinking it was implied. Mistake on my part.

Stack of the opener also covered hero. I guess I really didn't factor him in all that much, estimating he'd be opening here as wide as ATo+, KJo+, JT or J9s+, all suited aces, and any PP. I don't think he was adjusting his opening range at all in relation to position. In my mind this was decision between me and the BTN. But certainly a small percentage of time opener calls with QQ+, maybe even JJ.

Stacks of the 2 callers are unimportant; they're never calling. Any hand they can call with they would've 3-bet with.

Having read the comments I do think $1200 is too big a stack to try this and not the "perfect stack size" I originally thought. I think an $800 - $900 effective stack would've been a profitable bluff; that would offer the BTN 2:1 odds on a big call. His 3-betting range is likely very wide, potentially even a squeeze bluff given the loose opener and 2 callers behind. I think we get a lot of folds with a 4-bet here.

Thoughts on this?

hmmmm, it's kind of an interesting spot, I think we can jam with AJs, the wheel suited aces confuse me, it really depends on villain and his frequencies but anyway, i think we are just slightly too deep to ship it here but definitely might try something like this one day

good thread