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ploppy shoves 100bb into a 50bb pot, dry board

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01-10-2015 , 10:50 AM

scelsi

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,464

V is middle aged white day trader, played one hand so far where he limpcalled oop 60bb eff I bet flop, shoved his turn donk with AKcc on 9s5h3c9c and he rolls A9o.

es 650

Hero opens 44 20 lp, V flats SB, BB folds and utg limper calls.

Flop (60) Q83r

Checks around.

Turn (60) 4d, fd

V leads 40, utg calls I make it 150 V instaships utg folds.

Lolwat

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01-10-2015 , 11:16 AM

NeverLosesAtPoker

banned

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 4,448

Instacall.

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01-10-2015 , 11:17 AM

pgcounty

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3,183

Quick call, don't slow roll

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01-10-2015 , 11:35 AM

scelsi

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,464

I block all but one 43s combo, so his range is Q8, QQ, 88, 33, and one combo of AQs that picked up the fd. So quick call even though I get only 1.6:1?

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01-10-2015 , 12:19 PM

au4all

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 2,872

Quote:

Originally Posted by scelsi

I block all but one 43s combo, so his range is Q8, QQ, 88, 33, and one combo of AQs that picked up the fd. So quick call even though I get only 1.6:1?

An instant replay of your earlier thread?

If you're absolutely sure that everyone's continuation range is so narrow:
1. bet the flop
2. call the turn
3. check-raise your bluffs

Definition Value Bet: A situation where when the Villain continues, that is he/she bets/raises, that you're ahead.

If you don't believe that you can get value, then don't bet.

If you continually cause people to fold all their hands worse than a set, then don't be surprised to find your Villain with a set.

Last edited by au4all; 01-10-2015 at 12:25 PM.

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01-10-2015 , 12:58 PM

DeathCabForTootie

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,722

Quote:

Originally Posted by au4all

If you don't believe that you can get value, then don't bet.

This is the crux of this hand. His range is pretty narrow for sure. However why bet if we think V is only expert slow play QQ or 88. Given your other hand versus this particular villain, its safe to assume Q8, 33, 56, and 43 is in his range, not to mention he could be "protecting" TP given you're prone to getting aggressive with FD's and V has seen it first-hand.

Snap AINEC.

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01-10-2015 , 12:59 PM

DeathCabForTootie

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,722

Quote:

Originally Posted by scelsi

I block all but one 43s combo, so his range is Q8, QQ, 88, 33, and one combo of AQs that picked up the fd. So quick call even though I get only 1.6:1?

Lots more Q's are in his range now the FD is out there.

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01-10-2015 , 01:04 PM

wj94

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 7,951

Quote:

Originally Posted by scelsi

I block all but one 43s combo, so his range is Q8, QQ, 88, 33, and one combo of AQs that picked up the fd. So quick call even though I get only 1.6:1?

You have 45% against that range so yeah. What's the point of raising 44 if you're going to turn a set on a super dry board and then fold after you put $170 and 25% of your stack in? Cliffs:

Spoiler:

Double cliffs:

Spoiler:

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01-10-2015 , 01:15 PM

scelsi

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,464

Quote:

Originally Posted by wj94

You have 45% against that range so yeah. What's the point of raising 44 if you're going to turn a set on a super dry board and then fold after you put $170 and 25% of your stack in? Cliffs:

Spoiler:

Double cliffs:

Spoiler:

Sigh yeah : / just trying to evaluate whether I'm not ranging ppl narrow enough...

Spoiler:

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01-10-2015 , 01:20 PM

#10

scelsi

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,464

Quote:

Originally Posted by au4all

It's not that their continuation range is narrow, but that it's a classic WAWB and the spr is such that it could be a raise-fold for value, I think V given descrip (rec player) doesnt bet-shove all Qxdd.

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01-10-2015 , 01:29 PM

#11

DeathCabForTootie

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,722

Quote:

Originally Posted by scelsi

No, but a rec fish will bet/shove TP to protect against the FD.

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01-10-2015 , 02:17 PM

#12

cAmmAndo

The Situation

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,727

I rarely expect to see Top pair overbet ship here.

In previous hand v led turn oop with a string value hand. No other reads are given.

Could he be overplaying Q8... Doubtful.

Given a range of just 33 88 QQ and AQdd it's just about a break even call. I prob discount QQ a little if I think he's usually 3betting it but he will occasionally show up with a few other random spazes. We are never folding but I actually do think it's only a slightly +EV call. His bet/3bet ship is super polarizing and we have no evidence to this point that he bluffs.

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01-10-2015 , 07:36 PM

#13

NeverLosesAtPoker

banned

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 4,448

He's a day trader. He gambles for a living. I'd be shocked if he doesn't do the same thing with 2 pairs in this spot. QQ should definitely be discounted. 33 and 88 are a wash.

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01-10-2015 , 07:47 PM

#14

JGP417

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 195

Shove

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