Hero is sitting to LAG's immediate left on a 10-handed 1/3 table.

The LAG is raising and playing every hand because "he's here to play cards and not wait for AA because you wait hours for them and they are no good" in his words. He builds up his stack from $300 to $700 in 2 hands then gives it all away, and the cycle continues.

Few past hands:

1) EP raise $15, 2 calls, TAG 3bets to $75, V calls with As7d in LP, folds around. Then check/calls a 865ss board for $100, and leads Qs turn for $125, then check/folds missed river saying "fml, you see how many outs I have there? can't f*n hit"

2) Tripled up Hero when UTG raised $15, 2 calls, V calls, Hero raised $75 with AA otb, 2 calls incl V. Flop was K86r, Hero cbet $100 into $250, call, V calls... Turn 4ss ($550) Hero all-in for $130, call, V shoves for $450 with K9o and makes the middle guy fold (lol). AA holds up.


I made the following "otherwise-standard" folds against this player later in the game and felt miserable after seeing the flops... assume $400 eff everytime

1) V opened for $12 in MP (small sizing for him), I fold AJo next to act.. flop was JT9cc and I would have won a decent pot with TPTK..

2) Fish ($200) in MP raises $15, V next to act calls, I fold KQo in 5-way pot... flop of AT5r was checked around, turn was J giving me straight and V bet/bet with his A9o and got paid.. another pot gone from me..

3) V opens $15 in late MP, I fold QTdd in HJ.. 4 way flop of J92r where he cbets small and takes it away.. could have been mine again..


A problem everytime was I would call with all of those hands if I was on BTN vs V, but with 3 or so players everytime to act behind, I felt they were standard folds... BUT I'm wondering if I should be adjusted and playing looser when a guy like this is at the table.. because he gave away over $2k in 2 hours to others playing everything..

But they also say, if everyone's playing loose, you should play tight?

1 & 2 are easy raises in my opinion until you start to feel like people behind are adjusting to you raising V light.
I'd probably just flat QTdd in hand 3. Plays ok multiway.

The way to beat loose players is to let them spew off their money with weak hands while you call down with a wider range of strong and just kinda-strong hands.

You're gonna have to get to showdowns, and you're gonna have to gamble a little, and you're gonna have to go pay them off sometimes.

So yes, you counter loose-ness with tight-ness. Just not nittiness. YOu also h ave to couple that with some clever passive-ness to counteract their misguided aggressive-ness.

The other adjustment, is to isolate this terrible spew-master with a much wider 3-bet range. All three hands that you folded were excellent candidates for a pre-flop raise.

You want to get into hands with the whale before he goes broke. That doesn't mean playing random garbage OOP or when your not getting good enough odds.

If there are aggressive players behind you trying to isolate the fish with raises then you will need to be tighter. If the players behind you are playing looser and more passive, trying to get into as many hands as they can with fish, then you should be playing looser yourself.

How deep the whale is at any particular moment also really matters. You still need to be getting good enough odds. This is a particular problem with maniac LAGs because their stacks fluctuate so wildly. Your going to have to be aware of their stack every single hand.

Also, try to get a better seat. With maniacs who are playing 75% or more of hands and are almost always raising you are better off on their right. You can limp in and see what the rest of the table does.

Agree that all three hands mentioned seem to be good candidates for isolating LAg - at least until rest of table picks up that are 3 betting (relatively) light.

"They" are wrong.

How hard you would have hit the flop is extremely irrelevant and the fact that you are talking about what you 'could have' won is an indication that you are frustrated and not thinking straight.

AJo is good enough to 3bet vs. this guy for straight value.

KQo is a decent hand to squeeze but depends on the fish's tendencies, who is left to act, etc. Overall may be OK too with these two in the pot.

QTs I would fold in HJ and call in CO but that's me being tight.

All 3 hands are automatic 3bets.

I chickened out on 3betting these hands because the fish is calling my 3bets 100% no matter what, and it's really hard to get him off any pair on the flop.

He's calling 3bets with 100% of his range and stationing any piece of the flop and you are scared to 3bet AJo in position ? Are you in the middle of a major downswing or playing on a short bankroll?

Regarding my comment above, your hand is ahead of his range and you can get max value when you hit. You don't need to ever fold him off a pair for this to be hugely +EV

I would 3b the AJo, fold KQo and call or fold QTs.
Position on loose player is great.

Adjust your game in the sense you 3bet him linear with cca the range you open on the position regularly, call some speculative hands on late position.

First off, you want to sit on his immediate right so you see what everybody doeas.

Hand 1) AJo is a clear call for me. Play in p and let him stack off. 3bet possible but could put you in akward spots.

Hand 2) another clear call and reevaluate. Even if he bets flop I might peel with a gutter knowing i get a full payout.

Hand 3) another call and no reason to 3 bet here.

If you have position on him, then use it.

Otherwise change the seat, see what everybody doeas and play poker.

If he's a big enough spew monkey post flop then you should be 3 betting like crazy to get into heads up pots with him. That's the biggest thing that most people don't do. They sit around and wait with everyone else and usually don't get anything out of it. Go after him. Go get the money.

Surely these are all plays, whether you 3bet them or just flat IP. And if he is calling 100% of your 3bets, then your AJ/KQ is in great shape! You've gotta play hands against this guy in order to get his money.

And also don't be results oriented. What if you wouldn't have won those hands? Would you still be posting asking how tight those folds are?

Problem with 3betting a crazy player is lack of available fund in most players' wallet.

What do you do if the table adjusts by calling your 3bets more often so that you end up in a lot of 3bet four- and five-way pots?

Absolutely agree.

I have never had this happen. I got 4 bet once and folded which was probably just a big hand.

I've had a player or two call and then fold flop. I'd say most of the time no one is going to adjust. They'll just sit there irritated. Once they do start seeing flops they will play very straight forwardly. Honestly, it's a problem I wouldn't worry about until it starts happening. Most of the time you'll have gotten your money from the lag by then anyway. I don't really care if the lag leaves if I've taken 3-4 BI off him already. I just sped up the process and made sure it was coming my way.

Excellent posts and points by Spike in this thread. Keep it up, good read.

LLSNL tables don't adjust quickly enough or never do.

Few players might play back once or twice, but player pool simply does not have the funds to start widening range and adjust.

Neither do they have the knowledge or ability to deploy proper adjustment strategies. Vast majority just watches the LAG/fish/whale run over the table in frustration, while they sit waiting for QQ+.

I've seen it happen. Some loose players with deep stacks initially respect your reraises but get tired of being shut out of pots and see you show down a weaker hand than they expected, then they start calling your 3bets with the same ranges they used to call your single raises.

I try to gameplan for things that might happen before they happen, so even if it is a rare situation, I try to be prepared for when it happens. I'm wondering how often flatting a 3bet to start a cascade of callers is annoying enough to an iso 3bettor to get him to reraise less against a whale.

Well
If they adjust then ya of course you have to slow down. But then you're also owning them
With your value hands. I'm not saying to be indiscriminate. My 3 bet range obviously looks a lot different UTG+1 than it does on the button.

Also you can take a seat to the right of the whale when the chance presents itself and just limp raise the fools. I did that just last week.

But when you hit your top pair, you are going to have him outkicked and if you can't get him off a pair, he is paying you in stacks. So it becomes very profitable.