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Playing Super Deep Playing Super Deep

09-02-2015 , 02:22 AM
One of the casinos I play at has super loose/aggressive play with tons of all-ins. I'm mostly playing 1-2 and the buyin max is $300. But considering the number of all-ins it's not unusual to see multiple players with stacks in excess of $600 and sometimes even $1000 and in some cases I'm one of those players. For the most part when the effective stacks are very deep I tend to call very liberally with hands I can set mine with and tend to raise larger preflop with big hands so that it's more expensive for my other deep stacked opponents to chase speculative hands.

My question is what adjustments do you guys like to make in this situation? And do you think these super deep stacks start to erode the advantages of playing tight preflop since although trash hands rarely hit, when they do they usually have big implied odds?
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09-02-2015 , 02:41 AM
playing super deep is way overrated except against a very very small % of players(massive whales). even the bigger fish arent putting in 400bb w/o the nuts and maybe the 2nd nuts. fish just dont overvalue hands like they used to when super deep. if 400bb deep with a fish theyll just call you down if you raise them when theyd happily get it in 100-200bb deep.
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09-02-2015 , 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by EatMyDitka
playing super deep is way overrated except against a very very small % of players(massive whales). even the bigger fish arent putting in 400bb w/o the nuts and maybe the 2nd nuts. fish just dont overvalue hands like they used to when super deep. if 400bb deep with a fish theyll just call you down if you raise them when theyd happily get it in 100-200bb deep.
It's called no limit holdem. If people are ever refusing to felt without the nuts, put them in that position w/overbets when they have a capped range and you can represent nut hands. It's always good playing against bad players deep stacked, even if what makes them bad is that they're too tight in big pots.
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09-02-2015 , 04:45 AM
At one of the casinos I go to, they've got a 1-3 game with a max buy-in of $300 or half of the biggest stack at the table, so some nights you've got 4 or 5 stacks above $1500. I adjust by opening for higher amounts. I find too many people loosen up their preflop calling range too much when it gets that deep and they bleed money, either by calling $40 or $50 preflop with marginal hands and missing or doing things like calling with 46o and losing 100BB when they flop bottom two.
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09-02-2015 , 07:06 AM
Based on your questions, you should avoid playing deep for the time being. To give one example, you said you open up. The answer should be that you tighten up in EP and open up in LP. Position is far more important in a 400BB game than a 100BB. Another is that if your raising more with big hands, you're telling people what you have.

If you want to read more, I'd suggest reading Doyle SuperSystem II section. He doesn't state it, but it is about playing 400BB+ deep. The Bobby Hoff interview in HOC also gives some insight on how to play deep stacked.
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09-02-2015 , 11:49 AM
I agree, rereading Super System II helped me out immensely in an extremely deep 1/2 game I play in from time to time that I was having a hard time beating. Some of the concepts are inapplicable or outdated for use in online play or higher stakes NLHE but as applied to live 1/2-2/5 it is as on point now as it was when first published.
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09-02-2015 , 12:47 PM
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If you want to read more, I'd suggest reading Doyle SuperSystem II section. He doesn't state it, but it is about playing 400BB+ deep. The Bobby Hoff interview in HOC also gives some insight on how to play deep stacked.
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I agree, rereading Super System II helped me out immensely in an extremely deep 1/2 game I play in from time to time that I was having a hard time beating. Some of the concepts are inapplicable or outdated for use in online play or higher stakes NLHE but as applied to live 1/2-2/5 it is as on point now as it was when first published.
Thanks for the suggestions I'll make sure to check it out.

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Based on your questions, you should avoid playing deep for the time being. To give one example, you said you open up. The answer should be that you tighten up in EP and open up in LP. Position is far more important in a 400BB game than a 100BB. Another is that if your raising more with big hands, you're telling people what you have.
I probably could have written my original post more clearly but basically I play tight preflop whether I'm short or deep stacked. However, I'm more likely to do things like call raises with low mid pocket pairs if the stacks are deep because of the implied odds if I hit a set. Also when I raise I don't vary the amount based on what hand I have although I might raise more if the stacks are deep. In 1-2 live I'm only raising with strong hands cause with all the loose callers pf it's pretty much impossible to blind steal profitably. In the past I usually bought in for $200 and cash out when I got to $600 for bankroll reasons but sometimes I question whether it would be better to keep playing at a good table.
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09-02-2015 , 10:00 PM
Deep stacked play amplifies your advantages over weaker players. As such if you are going to play deep you should be confident that you have a sizable skill advantage over the table. This means good understanding of position, good reads, comfortable running bluffs when they make sense.

There absolutely are still fish out there who are happy to stack off 500+ BBs way lighter than they should. There are also people who aren't happy stacking off without the nuts. Te key is identifying each correctly and exploiting their flaw. If you can do that you'll never play short stacked again if you can help it.
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09-03-2015 , 09:02 AM
Low stake deep stack, is very profitable not because you get paid off by bad hands...(most of todays players don't do that) but...and here the fun part they think ATC can be played profitably...and they love to chase with stupid hands at least to the turn...with bottom pair type thing since "no one ever thinks that the bottom card pairing hits me". This means they are willing to put more money in with weaker ranges pre flop and flop.

Make bigger raises with hands like small pairs and suited Aces...you want to build a big pot with a big pot hand....hit a set in a big pot you get paid off...(they chase they shove there stupid draws what ever into big pre flop they don't do it in limped pots)....If your getting 3 bet big a lot this may change (but it almost never happens at 1-2)

3 Bet more.....they call 3 bet much lighter since they think deep ATC can crack Aces...but here's the thing you don't have aces that often...so you can build these pots get HU or 3 way...and steel them a ton...try double barrel bluff here a bit...

most players play pretty ABC in multi way pots....note the players who don't they tend to stick out...you know the ones who shove a small flush into a 6 way flop after the original raiser potted the flop...

Depending on your game you may want to make small (relative to your big raises) with hands like AK AQ (unless reasonable bigger raise get you HU or three way)....they flop medium size hands top, pair top kicker...so building a really big pot pre flop, just gets you into bad SPR for multi way pots....Your money comes from hitting a K...(your AK blocks the flop) betting and taking the multi way pot down on the flop or turn as it goes HU....bet fold when you hit one pair and get pressure (know who you have to be careful with here)


Watch you opponents tendencies...this is much more important deep stacked...know when they raise their big hands...who if any can bluf raise the turn....things like this because your strategy, is to bet fold tptk type hands a lot.

Plan on double barreling a lot when it goes hu. Deep stack is often against wider pre flop ranges and wider flop calling ranges, but they often tighten up by the turn. (

Over bet bluffs on the river when it goes HU..can be hugely profitable...if you know your opponents...most deep players often cap their ranges on the turn(they go for pot controle type thing) and many will fold their entire range to over sized river bets...

And yes you can call there raises a bit wider...but don't get stupid here...you really want hands that can make big hands..or with position and controle over the raiser you can call equity type hands...87s type, but don't do it to flop big...do it because with position you can put pressure on the right players. If your just going to play fit or fold consider folding many of these hands. The thing is when you hit a flush...your only going to get paid off big by bigger flushes...and if you hit two pair top pair hands are not going to pay you off often here either....but this means you can sometimes bluff well with position if your deep.
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