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Old 02-03-2021, 10:59 AM   #1
MHE
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 196
Playing against maniacs

Here's a hand I played yesterday. The place I play at has two regular maniacs who frustrate the **** out of me. They VPIP nearly 100%, regardless of preflop action. They both bet big constantly to put on max pressure. This particular guy always opens big, if you open he will often 3-bet 5x or more, stuff like that. Here's the hand with my thoughts:
$1-$2, 8 handed with plexiglass. Effective stack approximately $710
UTG limps, I open to $15 with 7c7s (this is standard opening size, especially from early position. Pocket 7s is the lowest pair I'd open with).
CO calls (man calls a lot preflop only to fold to almost every c-bet). Maniac calls in SB.
FLOP ($47) 9h2h2c. SB leads for $35. I put him either on a 9 or a heart draw. He'd lead either. If I raise to $100, he'd most likely 3-bet the 9 and just call the heart draw. I feel my 7s need protection here. CO folds. SB calls.
TURN ($247) Ad. SB checks. I bet $125. There is no way he has an ace. He would have 3-bet preflop. He bets/raises every ace pre no matter the action and will call his stack off pre with any ace. He calls.
RIVER ($497) 4c. He jams for $535. ???????
I have him on a missed flush draw or a 9 at this point. Nothing else really makes sense, though for that size bet, he's super polar and now I have third pair.
I ended up tank folding though I feel I should've called. He turned over a missed flush draw to try and tilt me.
The other maniac is a little different. He opens almost 100%, and I'm not exaggerating. Though his opening raise size is smaller. If someone opens he calls 100% whether in position or in the blinds. He calls 100% of flop c-bets unless someone jams and he has nothing, etc. What he does is check-raises big every single time someone double barrels a turn. He will do it with air, bottom pair, etc. Very frustrating.
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Old 02-03-2021, 11:57 AM   #2
QuadJ
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,425
Re: Playing against maniacs

Have multiple buy ins and be ready to get your stacks in.

Against a maniac what you can't do is give up on the river very often. On a sufficiently bad run out folding can be right but mostly if you get to the river you should have already put enough bluffs in their range that calling it off is best. One side effect of this is that hands like middle pairs that you might normally play for value but cautiously are worth less. The maniac won't let you play carefully or pot control, your in every hand playing for stacks. I would be trying to set mine with 77 from the start.

Against the second type of maniac you describe work out what his range is and be ready to get your stack in preflop or on the flop.

Against any maniac try to get right before or right after them. When you are before them go for limp/raise and check/raise to get stacks in when you have a good hand. When you are after them you can see more flops with drawing hands and apply a little pot control. Don't try to pot control flop unless you have a bad draw and want that one free card. Instead pot control the turn. They are going to donk bet the river a lot anyways so keeping the pot smaller on the turn is the best you can do.

Don't be afraid to just give up on the flop even if you are the preflop raiser. The maniac will be hard to get off any hand or even get to fold his air.
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Old 02-03-2021, 12:14 PM   #3
MHE
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 196
Re: Playing against maniacs

Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadJ View Post
Have multiple buy ins and be ready to get your stacks in.

Against a maniac what you can't do is give up on the river very often. On a sufficiently bad run out folding can be right but mostly if you get to the river you should have already put enough bluffs in their range that calling it off is best. One side effect of this is that hands like middle pairs that you might normally play for value but cautiously are worth less. The maniac won't let you play carefully or pot control, your in every hand playing for stacks. I would be trying to set mine with 77 from the start.

Against the second type of maniac you describe work out what his range is and be ready to get your stack in preflop or on the flop.

Against any maniac try to get right before or right after them. When you are before them go for limp/raise and check/raise to get stacks in when you have a good hand. When you are after them you can see more flops with drawing hands and apply a little pot control. Don't try to pot control flop unless you have a bad draw and want that one free card. Instead pot control the turn. They are going to donk bet the river a lot anyways so keeping the pot smaller on the turn is the best you can do.

Don't be afraid to just give up on the flop even if you are the preflop raiser. The maniac will be hard to get off any hand or even get to fold his air.
I like that idea of pot controlling in turn. Iím gonna try that.
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Old 02-03-2021, 12:25 PM   #4
snowman
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: ON THE ROAD AGAIN
Posts: 1,495
Re: Playing against maniacs

what Quadj said


quit trying to out aggress a maniac.

sit back see flops cheap and reel them in when you spike a hand.
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Old 02-03-2021, 03:35 PM   #5
tdammon
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 332
Re: Playing against maniacs

I don't get why you're even trying to be tactical against these type of players. Wait for a good hand TT+ AJ+ and get the money in. Small pocket pairs only have set value against this player so I would either be folding them or limp calling to see a cheap flop.
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Old 02-03-2021, 05:06 PM   #6
WereBeer
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,594
Re: Playing against maniacs

One thing is don't make the mistake I see often when someone is raising like 40+%: overcalling with garbage to try and bingo the flop. You get those big call chains, only overcall with hands that play well multiway. Fold garbage and 3bet big with strong hands to pick up dead money and iso the maniac.
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Old 02-03-2021, 05:10 PM   #7
OmahaDonk
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Posts: 3,193
Re: Playing against maniacs

Over limp pre. With these guys not folding the only value if 77 is a set. As played don’t raise flop and don’t bet turn
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Old 02-07-2021, 07:34 PM   #8
javi
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,456
Re: Playing against maniacs

Dont ever raise the flop just to induce a 3bet with the intent to fold. If you think he might have a pair of 9's then just call. Yeah you can get outdrawn, thats what happens when you play pocket 7's, and this is what happens when you play them vs a known maniac and you miss. This is why you have to wait for premium hands, not speculative ones.

On the turn you say "no way he has an ace", cmon, unless you're playing on a live stream or cheating you have no idea how often he's really 3betting every ace preflop. You just told us how he's constantly 3betting all the time so clearly he does this with more than just an ace.

The rest of the hand I dunno, he's a maniac, he could have anything.
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Old 02-07-2021, 09:39 PM   #9
tmo1120
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Location: Southwest, FL
Posts: 1,021
Re: Playing against maniacs

One thing is crystal clear in this hand and that is that he is never turning a 9 into a bluff on the river, value overbetting a 9 to get called by 88 or 77 is probably the most savage play I've ever heard of, anyways you are right about him being polarized, these are the types of opponents that you can hero call so given that he is repping boats ( a very thin value range) and the front door misses i don't mind calling the river here

You have to be comfortable sticking in money light if you're going to be playing with players like this
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Old 02-09-2021, 07:48 PM   #10
donkatruck
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,211
Re: Playing against maniacs

I think I know where you are playing. Which of the maniacs are you talking about? One seems successful because you always see him with $1k stacks but you don't see he bought in 7 times before he was able to double up 2-3 times.
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Old 02-15-2021, 07:21 PM   #11
Vecissitude
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Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 123
Re: Playing against maniacs

Honestly man in crazy games like this where you have to open to 15$ you can take those 77 from early position and throw them away pre. You are risking 15$ to win a pot of 4$. You need to make sure you end up winning a lot and 77 is not going to cut it.
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