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Old 09-18-2014, 02:39 PM   #1
BusterMcNutty
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Played AA like a fool but got lucky

2/5 game. Hero and villain have never played before, and this is about the fifth hand of the session. Both are 25ish white guys dressed casually. Hero has a solid but not exceptional TAG image.

Hero, MP, $380, As Ah
Villain, OTB, $480

Folded to Hero, who raises $20. This was the same raise I made in a previous hand before folding OTF. Folded to villain, who calls. I was obviously hoping he'd re-pop it. Would love some critique here.

Flop, $47, Jh 8c 6c

Hero raises $60. Villain re-pops it to $160 after about 15 seconds. Hero tanks for about 45 seconds, shoves all-in. Villain snap-calls.

I don't think I played this hand very well, and the fact that I got lucky is results-oriented thinking. He had Jc 7c and missed his flush draw. I'd appreciate any feedback on this hand.

Last edited by BusterMcNutty; 09-18-2014 at 02:48 PM.
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Old 09-18-2014, 04:17 PM   #2
lucius
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

the 2 mistakes in the hand:
- top up to full stack before the hand
- without history, flop cbet should be around 30

you didn't get lucky at any point of the hand, unless we call it luck that V flopped something he could stack off with to your aces
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:01 PM   #3
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Your stack size is important. When you're playing short-stacked, your strategy is to gii best you can if you draw something like AA. The only problem I see is that your pfr isn't quite sized right to easily get it all in without overbetting. Betting about 10% of your stack size is usually a good start* so if the table will tolerate a $40 bet without freaking out, that would be great. $35 would be almost as good. I would personally be eager to gii with this stack size and this flop.

--------

*see Miller et al "Professional No Limit Hold'em," pretty much required reading.
http://www.twoplustwostore.com/twopl...&productID=151
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:06 PM   #4
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Not sure why you think you "played it like a fool". This hand is a completely standard spot with 80bb (or even 100bb). Also, the fact that you don't have the ace of clubs in your hand makes it an even easier spot to get the money in.

(Edit, Flop bet is a bit too big, 35 works well).
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:10 PM   #5
au4all
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucius View Post
the 2 mistakes in the hand:
- top up to full stack before the hand
- without history, flop cbet should be around 30

you didn't get lucky at any point of the hand, unless we call it luck that V flopped something he could stack off with to your aces
Hero got very very lucky. On average he should about break-even in this spot. Instead he more than doubled-up.

Board: Jh 8c 6c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 52.525% 52.53% 00.00% 520 0.00 { Jc7c }
Hand 1: 47.475% 47.47% 00.00% 470 0.00 { AhAs }
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:11 PM   #6
thehelper
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
Originally Posted by au4all View Post
Hero got very very lucky. On average he should about break-even in this spot. Instead he more than doubled-up.

Board: Jh 8c 6c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 52.525% 52.53% 00.00% 520 0.00 { Jc7c }
Hand 1: 47.475% 47.47% 00.00% 470 0.00 { AhAs }
I see you're familiar with pokerstove, now try doing ranges that villain will have instead of just the specific hand villain showed up with.
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:15 PM   #7
tw1n_k0i
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

The raise size pre is fine. 40 is ridiculous but at some games you might be able to get away with it.
Bet 40-45 on the flop. 60 is too big.
As played I fold to the flop raise. You overbet the pot and then he raises you. This is typically very strong. If you want to continue you should flat the flop and lead non flush turns.
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Old 09-18-2014, 05:57 PM   #8
BusterMcNutty
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

The diversity of responses here is awesome, as always. The only comment I have to add is that my game doesn't limit the buy-in, so topping off isn't really feasible. If you want to buy in with 5K, buy in with 5K. After buying in with 400, my 380 put me about third.
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Old 09-18-2014, 06:08 PM   #9
Steve00007
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
2/5 game. Hero and villain have never played before, and this is about the fifth hand of the session. Both are 25ish white guys dressed casually. Hero has a solid but not exceptional TAG image.
How do you have a solid but not exceptional tag image if it's only your 5th hand and you never played with villain before?
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Old 09-18-2014, 06:21 PM   #10
BusterMcNutty
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

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Originally Posted by Steve00007 View Post
How do you have a solid but not exceptional tag image if it's only your 5th hand and you never played with villain before?
I meant in general. I don't suppose that note was terribly relevant.
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Old 09-18-2014, 06:33 PM   #11
trucdouf
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Seems pretty standard, but I don't like the overbet.

I assume given topic title V flopped middle or bottom set and we binked, maybe V is loose and he flopped the straight and we boated?

Either way standard hand given stack. Maybe a fold if we knew anything about V...
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Old 09-18-2014, 07:20 PM   #12
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
Originally Posted by BusterMcNutty View Post
I meant in general. I don't suppose that note was terribly relevant.
I don't think you really have an image. Not after 4 hands. Notice that you didn't mention any reads on villain after 4 hands, maybe because you didn't have enough information after 4 hands to have any reads.
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Old 09-18-2014, 07:23 PM   #13
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
Originally Posted by au4all View Post
Hero got very very lucky. On average he should about break-even in this spot. Instead he more than doubled-up.

Board: Jh 8c 6c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 52.525% 52.53% 00.00% 520 0.00 { Jc7c }
Hand 1: 47.475% 47.47% 00.00% 470 0.00 { AhAs }
So what if he doubled up? According to that hero doubles up almost 50% of the time. That's not "very very lucky."

Using your reasoning even villain would be very very lucky if he won.

So using your reasoning, if villain wins he is very very lucky. If hero wins he is very very lucky. Huh?
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Old 09-19-2014, 12:41 PM   #14
BusterMcNutty
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

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Originally Posted by Steve00007 View Post
I don't think you really have an image. Not after 4 hands. Notice that you didn't mention any reads on villain after 4 hands, maybe because you didn't have enough information after 4 hands to have any reads.
Yeah, you're right. I have an image with the rest of the table, who are all regulars except villain, but not with this villain. Fun side note, he only called two more of my pre-flop raises the rest of the night, and folded both when I raised OTF.
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Old 09-19-2014, 01:03 PM   #15
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

If you're playing correct short stack strategy your table image will be nitty.

You would think this would make people stop and thing before calling your pfr. But they often don't. If the table is so darn nitty you aren't getting any action, you might consider changing tables. Don't get cute, play it straight up
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Old 09-19-2014, 01:52 PM   #16
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Don't see much wrong here at all really. OOP pocket pairs are always tricky. In MP you can limp/rr or open like you did here. From MP you want to open the 'standard' table bet to hide your hand strength and go from there.

I actually like the over bet OTF as it brings stacks into play if either of you raise the Flop or Turn. Against your regs this may have been an insta-fold but he had the perfect holding for your play here. Pair and a flush draw are usually 40% or better against an overpair and if you find someone who wants to gamble/flip then away you go!!

Sure the overbet pretty much ends the hand most of the time, but at 2/5 the pot size was pretty small .. nothing wrong with jacking it up to $100 OTF here. GL
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Old 09-19-2014, 02:23 PM   #17
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Never include the results/V hand. Give that about 24 hours later. Read the stickies.

At a no max buy-in table, I'd prefer to buy in to cover everyone you think you can beat. So probably should buy in $500 at this table. But if you're trying to short/medium stack, so be it.

Preflop, I prefer to bet more, if I can, meaning, make it more from MP always (not hand dependent), but if 30 always gets folds, then this amount might be right.

Flop, I kinda like the overbet, because it's a wet board. People are more likely to be on draws and more likely to pay you off when it's wet. I'd have probably bet 40, but 60 might be better. Shoving is good if you respect this player, that he will tend to push with big drawing hands. You could also call and shove a non-connecting (straight or flush) turn card. But, if the guy is fishy/passive, then you have to fold. Since you say he is aggressive (believing you when you say tAG), then this is probably a good stack off. It just depends upon how aggressive/passive(fishy) this guy is.
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Old 09-19-2014, 08:52 PM   #18
BusterMcNutty
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Re: Played AA like a fool but got lucky

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerodox View Post
Never include the results/V hand. Give that about 24 hours later. Read the stickies.

At a no max buy-in table, I'd prefer to buy in to cover everyone you think you can beat. So probably should buy in $500 at this table. But if you're trying to short/medium stack, so be it.

Preflop, I prefer to bet more, if I can, meaning, make it more from MP always (not hand dependent), but if 30 always gets folds, then this amount might be right.

Flop, I kinda like the overbet, because it's a wet board. People are more likely to be on draws and more likely to pay you off when it's wet. I'd have probably bet 40, but 60 might be better. Shoving is good if you respect this player, that he will tend to push with big drawing hands. You could also call and shove a non-connecting (straight or flush) turn card. But, if the guy is fishy/passive, then you have to fold. Since you say he is aggressive (believing you when you say tAG), then this is probably a good stack off. It just depends upon how aggressive/passive(fishy) this guy is.
Thanks for the input; didn't realize that was a breach of etiquette.

Definitely wasn't short stacked. The only bigger stacks were this gentleman and the game runner, who only plays to stimulate action, not win stacks.

I think what bothers me about this hand was my shove. I've yet to come across any tight players at this game, and J8, 66, or 88 was definitely within in his range. Chalk it up to catching a break on a flip and keep in mind the lesson for later I suppose.
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