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Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise

05-29-2019 , 10:51 PM
Hero 600$ 1/2 live

HJ can be a little crazy but is hitting. Not too much of a read on him. Has hero covered.

Utg+2 is a younger guy who seems fishy.

Hero TcTs in sb.

UTG+2 raise to 8$, HJ calls, hero raise to 30$, utg+2 and hj call.

Flop ($93) 562ccs
Hero bets 45$, HJ calls

Turn ($183) 2s
Hero bets 80$, villain snap raise to 180$, hero?
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-29-2019 , 10:56 PM
I would go $40 pre.

I'd go $60 on the flop.

On the turn I'd size up as well, I'd go $120. As played, I'm just calling the turn.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 12:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixsevenoff
I would go $40 pre.

I'd go $60 on the flop.

On the turn I'd size up as well, I'd go $120. As played, I'm just calling the turn.
If I call the turn I feel like I need to be committed at that point unless no club or over card hits.

If I just call and then check river. He can shove with just about anything. His missed draws, AKQJ if they hit, etc. I think at this point I need to make a decision to either go with it or not. Not saying I need to shove but what rivers am I check calling?
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 07:31 AM
fold or ship, most likely fold
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 07:50 AM
Dont go broke 300bbs deep with a pair of tens please

Dont 3bet pre this deep OOP

Edit: oh I just realized we're three way, yeah 3bet is fine, I fold to the raise tought
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 08:17 AM
In my 1/2 games, 30 3b is a big raise and signals the goods. But games differ. If I got two calls, I wouldn’t expect to be ahead always on this flop. Ironically Hero’s preflop raise works against him on this flop. Had H flatted pre from Sb, he’d have a huge range advantage here. Bad luck I guess.

Interestingly, it’s the preflop flatter who calls H’s cbet. This V is capped preflop to perhaps JJ at best. His turn donk can be A2s or 76s. Hero is still uncapped and barreling. OP should clarify the suits of these deuces as it matters for analysis. There cannot be two 2s.

Im calling because we’re ahead of two combos of 76s that might make this move and behind two combos of A2s. We’re getting 5-2 on call. It’s a tough spot. I guess he could have JJ. But I think he’d raise them preflop if his description is accurate.

The plan for the river might be to barrel any overcard rivers and fold to a raise.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 08:38 AM
He could also have 77-99 that we are beating. We block a good amount of FDs with our TT (both flushdraws and the T that is a key card for possible flushdraws from the villain).

If you think he could be shoving this much of bluffs rivers you have a pretty good Bluffcatcher. You also have a good call against his values (77-99) and good odds to call Turn. I think I would play the hand the same (sizings are fine when blocking FDs) and call all river bets.

That are lots of cards that can make him X back also. So The call turn is kinda mandatory and we can than even fold some rivers (maybe overcards and cards that completes OESD’s)
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 09:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanishmoon
In my 1/2 games, 30 3b is a big raise and signals the goods. But games differ. If I got two calls, I wouldn’t expect to be ahead always on this flop. Ironically Hero’s preflop raise works against him on this flop. Had H flatted pre from Sb, he’d have a huge range advantage here. Bad luck I guess.

Interestingly, it’s the preflop flatter who calls H’s cbet. This V is capped preflop to perhaps JJ at best. His turn donk can be A2s or 76s. Hero is still uncapped and barreling. OP should clarify the suits of these deuces as it matters for analysis. There cannot be two 2s.

Im calling because we’re ahead of two combos of 76s that might make this move and behind two combos of A2s. We’re getting 5-2 on call. It’s a tough spot. I guess he could have JJ. But I think he’d raise them preflop if his description is accurate.

The plan for the river might be to barrel any overcard rivers and fold to a raise.
2c was on the flop, 2s on turn bringing 2 flush draws. didnt mean to make it look like 2s was on the flop as well.

to call his raise then lead river seems a little off though doesnt it? i dont know what hands i would play that way. so we would call his raise, then barrel river for say 200ish? then fold if he shoves for like 150 more? this just sounds like it makes no sense. if i call there's 540$~ in the pot on the river. to bet 200$ then fold to a shove would mean we are folding for 150$ when the pot is 1000$?

Quote:
He could also have 77-99 that we are beating. We block a good amount of FDs with our TT (both flushdraws and the T that is a key card for possible flushdraws from the villain).

If you think he could be shoving this much of bluffs rivers you have a pretty good Bluffcatcher. You also have a good call against his values (77-99) and good odds to call Turn. I think I would play the hand the same (sizings are fine when blocking FDs) and call all river bets.

That are lots of cards that can make him X back also. So The call turn is kinda mandatory and we can than even fold some rivers (maybe overcards and cards that completes OESD’s)
If we block FDs isn't that bad for us? This means its more unlikely he is doing this with a flush draw. If he is, we block his outs.. but we also block holdings like 9Ts/JTs/QTs/KTs/ATs

Last edited by Phraust; 05-30-2019 at 09:34 AM.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 09:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phraust

If we block FDs isn't that bad for us? This means its more unlikely he is doing this with a flush draw. If he is, we block his outs.. but we also block holdings like 9Ts/JTs/QTs/KTs/ATs

Hmmmmmmm agreed.
So maybe our BFC isn’t that good, but I still think we have good odds vs his values turn.

On that case the river would depend on the card that comes and the sizing he uses. Does his value raised hands turn bet this river that big? If the answer is no we can fold.
If the answer is yes we can call.

Think I would go that way, but this hand ins’t clear for me. Lot of doubts too.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 09:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phraust
If I call the turn I feel like I need to be committed at that point unless no club or over card hits.

If I just call and then check river. He can shove with just about anything. His missed draws, AKQJ if they hit, etc. I think at this point I need to make a decision to either go with it or not. Not saying I need to shove but what rivers am I check calling?
Being OOP here sucks. The more I think about it, the more I like shoving...I was saying to flat to leave his bluffs in, but his bluffs are almost exclusively flush draws, which he'd happily call with a FD, considering image. This saves having to hero any river that doesn't complete. Turn card is great.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixsevenoff
Being OOP here sucks. The more I think about it, the more I like shoving...I was saying to flat to leave his bluffs in, but his bluffs are almost exclusively flush draws, which he'd happily call with a FD, considering image. This saves having to hero any river that doesn't complete. Turn card is great.
I’m coming around to your view here. I didn’t keep track of pot size when I recommended call then shove overcard rivers. Was too focused on coffee and V’s range .

There’s two combos of A2s he might have versus 4 of 76s here plus 12 77-99 and a bunch of NFDs and suited Broadway combos. OOP it’s better to blast off here Than call. I mistakenly ignored SPR here and Op reminds us correctly that it’s getting really low if he just calls.

Where I differ with OP is that I think V’s range is capped by his preflop flat. If we blast off we can fold his non-nutted suited Broadway range. We’re still uncapped on turn. If we flat we level ourselves into xc river which allows him to jam a lot of rivers with impunity. We’d get decent odds to call river (2-1 at least) but it’s a tough spot. Better to shove now with FE versus all his over combos. If he has exactly A2s I guess we get felted.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote
05-30-2019 , 10:03 AM
I'm folding and I'm really not that sad about it. Everything you've done in this hand screams I have an overpair (3b pre, lead into 2 players on badugie board, continue on badugie turn). He's saying he has an overpair beat. Unless he's a mega donk who would stack off with 88 or a maniac who would bluff off on this board for 300bb, I'm inclined to believe him. When people in LLSNL put 300bb in the middle, they ~always have it.

If you HAD to continue with TT, which you really shouldn't considering you have plenty of better overpairs, pick a different combo. You have the worst possible TT to bluff catch with because you're blocking both flush draws.
Overpair on low paired board facing snap raise Quote

      
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