Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr
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I misread the part about limping. I thought you said 16% when he doesn't limp. Sorry. But you are backpedaling about the player's description and arbitrarily thinking he won't open AJs or KJs or QJs or JTs (why??)
I agree a 16/16 player is a TAG. But that's an average and in fact about what I average if we're talking VPIP/PFR. And I open about 10% UTG. There is no contradiction. I don't get how you label him a 16/16 TAG but think he's opening like 3 to 4 percent UTG. That is a nit opening range and what I focused on in my response since we've been talking about what a solid TAG who never limps would open UTG not what his total stats are.
Besides, this stuff is new information. All we know is your initial read. And you seem to be missing the point about your read being accurate. Of course over 80 hands you can't have anywhere close to a perfect read. You make the best guess you can. Your educated guess was presented as this guy being a solid ABC TAG. To me that means you think he's a TAG who wins something like 6+ BB/hr. A pro basically, but not necessarily a crusher. And you form your ranges for this hand based on that, not from information you've gained three days later. Any information gained after the hand is irrelevant to your evaluation of this hand.p Thinking otherwise is being results oriented.
And the open range I gave is very standard UTG TAG opening range. I cited two sources of similar ranges from very credible expert sources, CLP and Janda. Here is another (IMO slightly less credible) from Jonathan Little's Small Stakes Poker Cash Games book
22+, AJs+, KQs, QJs, JTs, T9s, 98s, AQo+ (10.1%)
The composition is a little different and Little describes it as overly tight, but the % is similar. Little focuses on hands that are easy to play.
And another from Ed Miller in The Course
22+, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, T9s, 98s, 87s, 76s, AQo+ (14.3%)
I think this is a bit too loose except in very tight games, but the point is every single source I have checked written for low stakes cash games has suggested UTG opens of 9 to 14 percent. That's pretty much the definition of "standard".
A solid TAG should indeed be opening *something like* what I posted in a 200BB game, and I haven't seen any logical refutation of this from anyone, just comments about how it's way too loose and absurd hyperbole that I better bring 10 buyins even though I've been using this range (I deviate based on table but it's my average more or less) averaging over 10BB/HR for the 1500 or so hours I've accumulated since moving here.