probably time for another mod intervention?

Agree with this. Training sites only accelerate the learning of people who likely would've ended up good anyways. it's not like they are a replacement for hard work.

Just look at the pgc threads of fish who get good advice and get told to go study who don't even do it. And those are people that post on this site and sort of want to get better. How likely do you think it is for your avg live casino fish to go study on a training site if they even knew what it was? And a lot of them probably think they are actually good anyways.

Sry didn't mean to come off hostile.

Thought the wink made it clear I wasn't being super serious.

Anyway I think we have different definitions of scary. LAGs and maniacs are not scary to me especially if losing LAGs as most are. They just spew money in your direction if you adjust properly. To me scary players are players better than I am who are aggressive enough to put me in lots of awkward spots where I don't really know what the correct decision is. So far I haven't really encountered anyone like this in my room. Squid plays in my room, or did, and I suspect he's better than the other pros I've run into, but I've yet to see him there after being here a while (hence me joking he's a ghost story).

Don't want to speak for him but pretty sure he's played lots of 5/T but prefers 2/5 for whatever reason. In this market the 2/5 games might be more lucrative, and the 5/T doesn't run every day. The 2/5 is certainly less stressful as well.

If one can make 12BB/hr at 2/5 or 7 BB/hr at 5/T one might reasonably choose to play 2/5 though you make a bit less money. Less waiting for seats however and there are almost always good 2/5 games while with 5/T you can't do much in the way of table selection. There's typically 0 to 2 5/T going here and the player pool is pretty small.

Personally my roll is big enough to start playing 5/T but I'm fine staying at 2/5 a while longer, probably six more months minimum. Trying to move up right now would just stress me out bigtime.

I am worried. You're claiming that upswing will make them worse players. Sure some of them might bluff too much, but ultimately they will learn a sound preflop strategy and then the 4 hand categories will eventually teach them a sound postflop strategy. A -50 bb/hr fish can easily become a -30 bb/hr fish, then a -10 bb/hr fish then with some work, a break even player.

Funny how you say fish still call it off with TPNK. I just iso raised this huge station with AK to 18 at Aria 1/3. K22ss flop he check I bet 20 he calls. Should've bet bigger that was a mistake. Anyways Turn 7. He checks I bet 75 he calls. River 7 I bet 185 he tanks, shows a king and surprisingly folds. From a GTO perspective I shouldn't bet big because what bluffs do I have, but from an exploitative perspective a station shouldn't fold a king to a less than pot sized bet (I'm not even sure it's a GTO fold). But since this isn't 2010 anymore, a king folded!

Also, since I think you were the guy who said I had entitlement issues and that's why I'm "stuck" at 1/3, watch your attitude. I stand by my 3 bet in the thread I posted recently because given the way he played the hand and his turn sizing he rarely has a hand strong enough to continue OOP and deep. I don't FPS. All my plays are backed up by math. An ABC player will think some of the plays I make are ridiculous. That's fine. The math supports what I do. The variance will punish me, but I don't think it's good poker to sacrifice +EV plays to lower variance especially at 1/3. Yes it's fine to iso raise a big fish with 63s in position. Why? Because I'll either lose a small to medium pot trying to make him fold his trash or I'll win a huge pot when I make a big hand. Or I'll flop a pair and win a small to medium pot sometimes vs his bricked draws. It's that simple.

You trash talk squid and call him a nit, yet you trash talk my "FPS" moves. Good job not contradicting yourself.

+1, totally agree with this. Even from a winrate point of view to keep it decently on track,i sincerly think guys like Doug Polk and Upswing isnt making it worse on the LLSNL market. Because just like you mention so many players misapplayingthe concepts they pick up from Polk and his courses (or is much more likely to do so), they often miss the context,forget about all other more important factors in low stakes games, and dont have the neccesary baseline/groundwork pinned down in order for them to apply the concepts in a correct sufficient way.

Instead fish,regfish and losing players have gotten some premium excuses to keep calling as is still LLSNL villains number one leak (on the top of my range, haz to cawl), i had blockers to the nutz (haz to cawl) or i had a good hand to bluff from some charts i have been studying, so therefore i spazzed out doubling up old man coffee who obviously was nutted. I see so much spew being done and defended by comments so that i instatly knows that the guys got their influences by sources such as Polk/Fee/Upswing.

Yes: the small amount of already winning players or players that have a clue AND are willing to work hard on their game will (possibly) get from a 2/5 slightly winning player to a crusher over time with the help from these sources. But in most instances the fish and losing players just got better more sound excuses to spew/make losing plays over and over again in my opinion.

Last 1000 hours of 2/5. The graph shows 1060 hours but that includes breaks. Its actually 1010 hours.

Win rate $50.18/hr
Winning sessions 67%
StnDev..$300.10 /hr

Admit it, Mike, you cherry picked it to have an almost exact 10BB/hr winrate

Either way, nice results!

LOL.

Hello bodybuilder,

I have played a fair amt of 5/t in my time. I also have an absolute ton of hands at 1k nl on line from back in the UB days. In the gamboolin biz it is really important to be humble cuz as soon as you think you know everything you get dropkicked. 5/t kind of fell out of my rotation cuz it just wasnt being spread that much in my home casino (I am a massive fan of homefield advantage). For me life is not all about maximizing EV. It is more about maximizing low stress and having a good time. I personally found that playing 2/5 really hit that sweet spot for me. I could win at north of 50 bux per hr with effectively zero variance. I could also crank out a sht load of hours.

My kid is about to graduate college and my personal expenses are very low. I have plenty banked and it is no longer necessary for me to work. So I have not played poker in quite a while and I have zero intention of doing so in the future.

I know I have said it a mirrion times but after BF I told my woman I had about 2 years of live poker in me. I lasted nearly 7. Could I have won more playing 5/?t Sure. However, it would not have been nearly as smooth of a ride and I would not have played nearly as many hours. So maybe I actually won the most I could have. I do not know - but I do know that the amt I won was plenty for me to raise a kid and have a lot of fun with her at the same time.

I wish u and all the dudes on 2p2 the best and hope you make it to the highest steaks and get all teh maniez.

Wins 2+2

Crusher! You are proof of why it pays to not be a nit!

lol...thanks gator

also very nice giraffe mike. He is a perfect example of how low stress 2/5 is when you figure out the formula. Well done brotha!

TY Sir. There are also very few 5/10 games available to me. I do play it occasionally when it pops up but Im totally happy playing 2/5.

Nice giraffe Mike!

Gcongrats!G

Maybe you mean a distinction between GTO strat talk and GTO application at the table? While someone playing GTO won’t maximize his or her wintate, they will certainly be very bad for you since they will scoop
Money from the worse players at some rate, while remaining unbeatable to you. Right? Or did you just mean that those players who talk about it don’t know how to properly apply it and thus end up spewing?

He means playing GTO versus mouth breathing cretins is spewing which it is and why everyone that passes through LLSNL preaching GTO goes bust (and it’s hilarious to watch).

I study gto, but also think about and study ways to deviate for exploiting my current situation. As a trivial example,
I’m not going to have a gto response to being 3bet at 1/4 and 2/5 versus most opponents. I will exploitively overfold.

But I like studying to have a relatively GTO base from which to form these more
Exploitative plays. I feel this gives me a “safe” default action in situations my reads aren’t strong. It allows me to develop a game that will easily translate to changing game environments, including higher stakes/tougher competition, and it will allow me to better and more quickly recognize imbalances in my opponent’s games and know how to profitably exploit them.

Is that reasonable? Or no?

but of an overstatement. prob the best 2/5 crusher i know works a lot with solvers. he still plays exploitatively from time to time, but he reviews most of his HH via solvers, and I also text him asking him to tell me what PIO says.

not only does he crush 2/5, but he's setting himself up to stay well ahead of the curve in the next X years as well as the ability to move up in stakes+venture off into tournament play.

Is using a solver to increase your win rate relying on complicated maths at the table during the hand or more or less memorizing the hands you put through it?

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You'd have to be pretty dense to think GTO would apply in any way or form against 1/3 fish, who go bust within 2-3 hours where you may only be involved in 1 or 2 pots with them and the only thing that's required to felt them is to exploit a range advantage.

By all means, play GTO against the regs in your room with whom you have 50+ hrs of history, but to pretend it's necessary against an ever rotating opponent pool at 1/3 is lunacy.

What it is, really hard to win at llls or there are still tons of fish and eazy 10bb/hr to be had? Everyone is all dire as if the games are though to beat at all these days
? (Ps. I quit in 2010 for unrelated commitments so I'm asking as an "outsider")

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I think it depends where you play as well. The area I play the players are still terrible. The game on avg has gotten tougher I'm sure, but there are still plenty of players who have never improved since they started playing and never will.

Vegas? Minnesota has games but they're 1-200, never played those faux nl games not sure if they play well?

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California.