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Old 03-15-2019, 03:45 PM   #342126
Randal_Graves
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

You will get completely eaten alive trying to play a "lower variance" game at 5/10+. You would essentially just be sitting around waiting to cooler someone and at 5/10+ at least half the table is going to be winning pros ime
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:48 PM   #342127
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

Correct.
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:57 PM   #342128
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

Disagree. Only major market I havent played in is cali but they are quite literally giving it away at 5/10 and I only somewhat have to start thinking (meaning, playing about $50NLish as a comparison) at 10/25.

The A8 spot also does not = 20 other similar spots a session. That is ridiculous. A6-9 oop are the most difficult hands to play in 3b pots. Avoiding them is fine. Effect on ev is moot.

All of this .0001bb strat aside, lapi is absolutely correct about your mental game sabr. This is not an attack, but I am actually shocked that someone that has survived 10 years into live poker can have the ego you have. Most (all?) long term solid grinders i have met have squid's personality. Contrary to what it wants you to think, ego does not belong in poker.
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:59 PM   #342129
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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You will get completely eaten alive trying to play a "lower variance" game at 5/10+. You would essentially just be sitting around waiting to cooler someone and at 5/10+ at least half the table is going to be winning pros ime
Really?

Is this just hyperbole or is it possible that in reality half (or more) of the players at 5/10 and up are "winning"?

Seems really, REALLY, unlikely.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:06 PM   #342130
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

I can't believe this thread is free
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:13 PM   #342131
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

MCGA
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:17 PM   #342132
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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Really?

Is this just hyperbole or is it possible that in reality half (or more) of the players at 5/10 and up are "winning"?

Seems really, REALLY, unlikely.
I said in my experience. And I count people who break even/slight losers (who are rocks you can’t get money out of) as winning since they’re technically beating the rake. In Vegas, at 2/5 I would say there’s 2-3 winning regs on avg per table and that goes up to 4-5 at 5/10.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:19 PM   #342133
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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Really?

Is this just hyperbole or is it possible that in reality half (or more) of the players at 5/10 and up are "winning"?

Seems really, REALLY, unlikely.
It's true.

Not more than half of the player POOL are winning players, but it's not unusual for an actual table at any given time to contain 5 or more players who are winning players overall, because winning players tend to play more hours.

Compared to low stakes, the losing players at high stakes lose much faster (because there are more competent players to exploit all of their mistakes), and winrates between pros run much closer. This is why I'm essentially calling BS on anyone claiming to win at 10bb/hr at $5/10 and higher. Sure they might do it over a year or even two (because you can definitely run bad for that long as well), but it's not their EV. There just isn't that much dead money to go around.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:24 PM   #342134
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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I can't believe this thread is free
Oh go file a tax return
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:30 PM   #342135
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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Really?

Is this just hyperbole or is it possible that in reality half (or more) of the players at 5/10 and up are "winning"?

Seems really, REALLY, unlikely.
In my limited 5T experience (mainly playing it when it looks reeeeeally good) it's still 5-6 slight-to-big winners, me, and 1-2 spots.

Lapi, when you've played 5T what's the lineup been like?
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:32 PM   #342136
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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MCGA
Make Communism Great Again?

My Colonoscopy Got Aggressive?
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:34 PM   #342137
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

DCFT, while I can get behind randals clarified definition...I’d always remind everyone that what appear to be pros are in fact not pros. They are kids on heaters.

But yes I can get behind 1-2 strong winners and an additional 1-2 rocks/breakeven players per table.

Who said anything about a 10bb winrate? I’ve been challenging that nonsense since 2013 when I had one myself.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:36 PM   #342138
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

no room 4 ego in poker.

I have played winning 5/T on line back in the ub days
I have played winning T/25 live back in the glory years
I have played winning 5/T post black friday
I like being able to sleep at night. I like not sweating that I "run worse than all of humanity combined"
SPC gave me sht 4 not playin 5/T in florida. Maybe shes right? But when I played I seldom had losing months and have never had to worry about $ or my mental health

PS still miss poker exactly zero on a scale of 1-10

Today I took a little old lady flying who was about 150 years old who told me it was the most beautiful thing she ever did

I also took a chick who was lucky to b alive who told me it was a religious experience

I kind of like that feedback loop personally
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:39 PM   #342139
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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Today I took a little old lady flying who was about 150 years old who told me it was the most beautiful thing she ever did
Hit it?
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:41 PM   #342140
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

GGGILF?
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:46 PM   #342141
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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In my limited 5T experience (mainly playing it when it looks reeeeeally good) it's still 5-6 slight-to-big winners, me, and 1-2 spots.

Lapi, when you've played 5T what's the lineup been like?
Yeah... lulz I've never played 5/T... so LOL me right?!

But, think about what its going to take to have a player pool at 5/T and up where half are "winning" pros. I'm calling bullsh*t from the bleacher seats.

("Winning" is now defined as slight losers and break-even rocks. Ok cool. I guess these are the guys who are playing a low-variance style and who are getting "crushed".)

You walk up to the one 5/T game that's running, and you recognize the faces and know that the table is full of sharks, and you think, "yup, I'll fit in nicely here -- now where did I put my 5x 100bb buy-in chips again... also known as a late-model Kia".

Again, until 11t comes back to set the record straight, I'm really not sure where I stand on this.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:49 PM   #342142
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

When I see 5/T run I still really only see a couple 2/5 crushers playing it, several other players who would break even or lose slightly in the game, and a couple who would be taken advantage of. It seems roughly a 20%/60%/20% split for player quality to me.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:51 PM   #342143
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

Actually probably more like 30%/55%/15%(donation players).
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:54 PM   #342144
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:55 PM   #342145
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

11t is the one true winner of this thread.

Squid not far behind imo
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:57 PM   #342146
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

What do they say about “The Man in the Arena” again?
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:04 PM   #342147
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

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DCFT, while I can get behind randals clarified definition...I’d always remind everyone that what appear to be pros are in fact not pros. They are kids on heaters.

.
For these purposes it doesn't matter. When assessing the strength of the table, noting there are a few short term upstarts is academic since they will eventually get replaced with another crew of young upstarts. or better put the names change the players stay the same.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:07 PM   #342148
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

I'm in the arena.

Live poker is a joke.

-2/5
-5/10
-10/25 (ok it gets hard here but still silly)
-And higher from the hh miami posts

Maybe vegas is tougher. I dunno. Not sure if bellagio counts as real 5/10 but the 3 day, 15ish hours I played there were some of the most incredible hours of poker spew I have ever seen at any stake.

If that was a bad sample (not from anything Ive heard) then move. I've moved for poker twice and Im not even a pro.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:21 PM   #342149
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

Fwiw $5/10 as little as 3 years ago was very different and I think I legitimately had an expectation of 10bb/hr back then. It wasn't uncommon for there to be 4-5 fish at a table, only 2-3 pros, and they weren't good at all.

Now every $5/10 game I play in has minimum 3 Euro pros with some Pokerstars and solver backgrounds. Some of them can be naive when it comes to live poker but in general those guys are tough to beat. Basically every reg at $10/20+ now has decent knowledge of GTO now though. You get weeded out pretty fast if you don't.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:23 PM   #342150
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Re: ***Official "It Lives, It Lives" Chat Thread***

Quote:
Originally Posted by squid face View Post
no room 4 ego in poker.

I have played winning 5/T on line back in the ub days
I have played winning T/25 live back in the glory years
I have played winning 5/T post black friday
I like being able to sleep at night. I like not sweating that I "run worse than all of humanity combined"
SPC gave me sht 4 not playin 5/T in florida. Maybe shes right? But when I played I seldom had losing months and have never had to worry about $ or my mental health

PS still miss poker exactly zero on a scale of 1-10

Today I took a little old lady flying who was about 150 years old who told me it was the most beautiful thing she ever did

I also took a chick who was lucky to b alive who told me it was a religious experience

I kind of like that feedback loop personally
Posts like this are good for my soul.
Also the posts about casinos being toxic environments resonate hard for me.
I think having an exit strat for career oriented poker is definitely worthwhile.
I only play several times a month and even that can feel like too much.
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