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OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular

11-11-2015 , 04:36 PM
1/3. I was in a laggish-fishy table where raises and reraises were flying around, and stack were up and down in seconds. Variance is the word of the day. I tried to play tag, and I had a good couple pots over 100BB, but the nature of the table drag me down to 150BB-ish.

In the UTG I had this fishy guy who likes to straddle and when the turn to play goes to him, blasts the pot sometimes with any two cards to 26 or alike. He has done more times than recommended, and it was a little tilting to be honest... but he didn't do it in the last couple rounds and I forgot. After 2 MPs called the 6, and I saw I had 56 in the CO, I happily completed the 6.

The regular in the BTN thought for a moment, and completed as well the 6. SB folds, BB completes, and the straddle blasts 26 more.

I was kicking myself for forgetting that, but one of the MPs called (with around 100BB), so I called myself. Probably the best here is to fold, because the BTN is still to act, and if he remembers the whole straddle thing and it was trapping, the best way to play is to reraise. But I wasn't thinking (tilting), and fortunately the BTN just called after a forever 30 seconds. the BB folded.

The pot is 134 after the rake. The flop came 87J

Straddle Guy bets 40 bucks, a ridiculous amount. The MP folds.

Hero?
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 12:38 AM
fold pre twice
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 01:11 AM
I don't think you know what an OESFD is...

As played I think we need to call and see a turn card but we probably have to fold if we don't hit and our opponent leads into us. Pretty bad spot we probably should have folded pre twice to avoid this...

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OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 01:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SillyRabbit
I don't think you know what an OESFD is...

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I havent gotten to the turn yet...
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 02:28 AM
Obviously pre is bad.

flop is probably a fold because you are technically open ended but one of your outs makes any T a straight and even if opponents don't have that its hard to get paid. Maybe you can take on off OTF given the price but not really any farther.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 02:44 AM
Folding pre flop, especially since the straddler habitually shows aggression when other opponents limp on his straddle. As played, pretty easy fold since if a "9" comes we either don't get paid if we hit or it makes V a bigger straight and we lose quite a bit of chips. Thus, we only really like 4 cards in the deck and as a result I fold and move on to the next hand.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 06:27 AM
I think we have 4 outs and could already be dead so I snap fold here.

Also agree with folding pre.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 04:18 PM
I think is right to fold pre. But lets think for a moment that the regular will call here only with big cards/pairs (I can't put him here with JT), and the straddler can have anything -so be it with this one. Having a little more than 3 to 1 is no good?

My concern on the game was if the BTN was going to blast, and then yes indeed Im in a bad spot. So objectively, I should fold because I don't know what this villain is going to do...

I made a bad call, and the villain on the btn just called -big mistake.

The Turn (~260) came 2

The straddler went all in for 60 more. The BTN behind me has around 120, I cover.

Hero?
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 04:26 PM
It's not such a terrible thing to be the raiser pre. If I'm playing a hand like 65s, I almost always raise it up. Otherwise fold.

I think in Harrington on Hold Em he says he plays about 20% of these SC for a raise. You have to assess your frequency based on your table image. If people think you're LOOSE and don't respect your raises, you're doing it too often.

But in general, if you do it minimally, a nice raise here is a very effective play. You might take it down; you might end up in position against a single opponent.

The problem with limping in is you are too likely to be the low flush or the butt end of a straight, as evidenced in this exact hand. I'm not limping w/low SCs pretty much ever.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-12-2015 , 06:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPCharly
I havent gotten to the turn yet...
I still don't think you know what an oesfd is.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-13-2015 , 01:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sierramist
I still don't think you know what an oesfd is.
I have an open ended straight, and a flush draw. If you want a perfect definition for me to have straight flush draw AND straight draw both open ended, you can post the hand yourself. Instead say something constructive, and dont waste bandwith trolling. For purist out there (although i think no one cares) next time i will define it as OESD&FD...
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-13-2015 , 02:55 AM
Fold pre to avoid this whole scenario of events.

1. Calling the straddle with 56s is too exploitable at a table like this and not neccessary.
2. Based on what you have said stealing with 56s doesn't seem so feasable to that only leaves folding.
3. Once villian raised his straddle its an easy fold. If this guy is making that many mistakes preflop and on the flop, it isn't really neccessary to get entangled in a big pot with such a marginal hand.

As played flop is a fold because you probably don't have enough information on aggressors turn play, plus the spot is difficult. This hand is a good example of how preflop mistakes lead to really ugly spots later in a hand. That is the lesson I would take away from this. If the guy is that spewy, it behooves you to wait for a better spot against him, not one where you will be forced to a dubious call on an awkward board. I would fold and chalk it up to not having a good preflop plan.

Last edited by Gerhman; 11-13-2015 at 02:56 AM. Reason: more info.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-14-2015 , 10:32 PM
Well, i called the All In, the other guy went all in as well. Oh well, i said, im commited and called. The straddler had AJs and the btn had set of 8s.

I hit a 9 on the river and won a monster pot. Not very proud, but it is what it is.

Thanks for commenting.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-15-2015 , 01:45 AM
Stop trying to win pots by calling down with 6-high. L/rr pre, and as played, raise the flop bet. Calling is arguably the worst of our options in both spots.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-15-2015 , 01:58 AM
Re-read table dynamics and my advice is no good. In bed and on a phone though so not gonna do a whole thing right now.
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-15-2015 , 02:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerhman
Fold pre to avoid this whole scenario of events.

1. Calling the straddle with 56s is too exploitable at a table like this and not neccessary.
2. Based on what you have said stealing with 56s doesn't seem so feasable to that only leaves folding.
3. Once villian raised his straddle its an easy fold. If this guy is making that many mistakes preflop and on the flop, it isn't really neccessary to get entangled in a big pot with such a marginal hand.

As played flop is a fold because you probably don't have enough information on aggressors turn play, plus the spot is difficult. This hand is a good example of how preflop mistakes lead to really ugly spots later in a hand. That is the lesson I would take away from this. If the guy is that spewy, it behooves you to wait for a better spot against him, not one where you will be forced to a dubious call on an awkward board. I would fold and chalk it up to not having a good preflop plan.
This

While it can be frustrating to watch some clown stack off with nothing, it is a lot easier to sit back and wait.
Just yesterday i was playing a very similar table, in 4.5hrs of play i was involed in 9 hands.
I didnt get involed with small SC for this exact reason. I dont know where i am at half the time cause people would play ATC.
Ended up waiting and winning a big pot with kings and some clown donked off 180bb with some trash hand.
After the session i was more proud of myself not playing trashy hands like 56ss etc than winning.
It creates discipline on the table which is more important than trying to gamble against some random donkey.
Just fold pre move on and wait, keep eye on the other players and pick you spots
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote
11-15-2015 , 03:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPCharly
Well, i called the All In, the other guy went all in as well. Oh well, i said, im commited and called. The straddler had AJs and the btn had set of 8s.

I hit a 9 on the river and won a monster pot. Not very proud, but it is what it is.

Thanks for commenting.
So you hit a 6 outter to win, love the gamble but i am sure once you called and saw the cards how bad you shape you are in that maybe you played this bad
OESFD against laggy fish and solid regular Quote

      
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