Two hands with sets

Hand 1

$1/$2 NL

Hero $200 with 44 limps for $2 in MP (FWIW loose passive home game) limps around 6 ways to the flop

Flop K94

EP1 bets $10
Hero raises to $30
LP all-in for $120
EP1 folds
Hero??

This is a call every-time because we are up against two pair, and flush draws, sometimes straight flush draws, because preflop action does not lead us to believe 99 or KK?

Hand 2

$1/$2 NL

Hero $200 with 55 calls $5 dollar straddle from button in LP (FWIW loose passive home game) BTN checks, 5$ ways to the flop

Flop 862

checks around

Turn 5

MP1 bets $15
Hero raises to $40
(This is to isolate, charge flush/straight draws, and fold if reraised by one of the three straight hands, 3-4,4-7,7-9)

Standard or just calling is a better play

hand 1

most of us would raise 99 in lp. not everyone. so, no, you can't rule it out. if he's got it, NH, move on. yeah, snap calling the all-in.

hand 2
fine. he probably has hands like 87 and 67 in his range as well. not sure i'm folding to a ship here either. villain would have to be a pretty big nit for me to fold.

cliffs: hard to hit sets. harder to fold them. you're destined to lose a big pot with a set if you lose.

Im not.folding in either, off we get pushed on in hand 2 there isn't much we beat depending on stack size

i can't even think of a player or player type that i would i fold to in hand 1. Hand 2 i'd raise bigger. Lots of combo draws you can have, and some he can have that aren't folding.

Villain (MP, $500) is one of the marks at the table. He's horribly loose, bluffy, a pay-off station, and in general just seems to be randomly clicking button half the time. He's a middle aged westernized east indian man. Earlier hand he limps, I raise AA, he calls HU with an SPR of 4; I pot flop of 884ss, he calls, I PSB shove a blank turn and he tanks for a minute or two before finally folding. I don't show, so he's probably got a lot of doubt as to whether he was good. I'm not exactly sure how he perceives me, if he perceives me at all.

Hero (Button, covers). Table is a nice and loose with lottsa payoff stations. No need to get out of line tonight, just sit back and rake in the monies with ABC. Villain is fairly new to table so I don't think he's seen me build my stack ABC-wise.

Preflop (10 players): Hero is Button with 7 7
4 limps, Hero overlimps, BB checks

Flop (6 players, ~$18): 6 5 3
Checks to Hero who bets $20, only Villain calls

Turn (2 players, ~$60): K
Villain checks, Hero bets $60, Villain calls

River (2 players, ~$180): 2
Villain randomly grabs a stack of $155 and puts it in the pot, Hero tank/calls

My plan was to check behind on the river but he thwarted that. I'm a little worried he's hit his K on turn, or perhaps had a random high flush card with a 4, but I'm not sure he bets large with these hands on a three-to-a-flush board. Does this reek enough of a busted flush draw to call here?

Any other thoughts on hand?

GcluelessNLnoobG

GG - I think the haphazard stack grab on this board/river = bluff a lot. Good call.

Check behind turn, bluffcatch call all non-spade rivers?

That was my first thought as well.

Ya, I thought about that (and that's a typical line I'd usually take).

I just thought there was a good chance he was chasing a spade draw and I could easily bet/fold turn and check behind river (if he had let me, damn it).

In the donkey filled games I play in, this is a 4 everytime, and the haphazard bet is because they "never put you on flopping a flush"

I don't like checking turn and giving a free card. Brian is much more likely to put money in drawing rather than bluffing.

I take it "Brian" is typo-spell check Villain... unless you, bubonic, and Brian cut cards together?!? Lol

Lol yeah stupid phone

Probably pretty standard but thought I'd post it:

Villain 1 is mid-20s, stabs at a lot of pots. Doesn't c-bet unless he hits the board. Raises a ton in all positions. Pot-builder raises to $7 or $8.

Villain 2 is awful. Playing every pot and hoping to get lucky. His VPIP is over 80.

Villain 1 raises to $8 in MP. Two callers. I have Kh8h on the button and make it $30. V1 and V2 call. Flop is AT4 rainbow and I decide to check and make a delayed c-bet on the turn, which is a K. Bet $40. Both fold.

Why check when you can charge? Betting is a ton better against passive stations.

He's a weird mix of passive station (in which case betting the turn is fine) as well as a bluffy maniac (in which case checking the turn to bluffcatch the river is also probably fine). I'm kinda torn on the two options, but he does whiff his draw far more often than he hits it, so I think that leans towards the bluffcatching route. Plus it also doesn't build a huge pot (setting up a difficult river situation like the one I had), plus saves me money when he hits his K on the turn.

Gmeh,maybeit'scloseeitherway?G

I've noticed in a couple of posts that you don't post stack sizes. I'm guessing this is a simple oversight on your part (instead of a really bad lack of understanding of how crucial they are to every decision at the table).

Assuming ~100bb stacks, I think preflop is a pretty easy fold. We have a crap hand and the villains are loose enough for us to end up very multiway , plus we probably have little FE on the flop as well. There's no need for this FPS at this table. Just sit back, wait patiently to get into a hand for cheap with a speculative hand or a premium hand, and then get paid off postflop when we hit.

As played, our preflop raise is probably too small and thus unlikely to take down the dead money right now (which would be a fine result) or get this HU at worst. Going 3way with a crap hand vs calling stations just sucks, imo. I would bet the flop, just a 1/2 PSB so that the villain's don't have to fold all that often for it to be profitable. This is one of the best flops we could have hoped for to represent when whiffing; all small-medium pocket pairs will probably have to fold with two overs as well as all small-medium connectors (and even though we're technically ahead of the latter, we're fine with taking down the pot now). The board is also fairly drawless except for gutshots. Unlike HU pots, I only cbet in 3way pots on decent boards, and I think this is that board.

Against fishy players, I have no idea why we'd want to implement a delayed cbet with air. We'd much rather do that with a made hand cuz we'll get paid off on the next two streets due to fish thinking "huh, what, he checked the flop and bet the turn, he's obviously FOS and I'm going to hero call down with my 4th pair".

I guess I don't hate the turn bet. You'd think that we woulda heard from an Ace on the turn since we checked the flop. So I'm fine with the bet with what is probably the best hand to protect our equity in the pot. Against tricky / bluffy / trappy players, I probably check back this turn with my showdownable hand and bluffcatch on the river.

Gnotafanofmostoftheplayinthishand,imhoG

Why 3b light when v2 has already called a raise. Doesn't seem like a good time to 3b as a bluff or semi bluff. I'd only be 3b for value.

Why did you decide to delay cbet. Probably more effective in non 3b pots.

1/2. I think semi standard boring spot.

V1: weak fit or fold middle aged guy. Have isoed a few times and he has c/f flop hu. 250 eff.

V2: middle aged women. Plays abc and can actually vbet her made hands. Somewhat loose pre but tighter post flop. May view me as agro. 400 eff

I cover.

V1 only limper in mp. Folds to me otb and I raise to 15 with J9o. V2 calls from SB and v1 folds.

Flop 34: AJ7r. v2 checks. I check.

Anyone betting here? Since she is not particularly loose I don't think I can get value from worse. We have no history yet where she has called me on any street particularly light.

Turn 34: 5 completing rainbow. v2 bets 12.

Anyone just folding here? I decided to call, but I don't think that makes much sense if I haven't seen her stab at pots or vbet thinly. I know not betting flop put me in this situation, so maybe the mistake was made there.

River 58: 6. v2 bets 30. I fold. Think this is the least interesting street.

No but you could get her to fold better (QJ/KJ/JT, even QQ if she doesn't 3bet it). Plus you might get her to fold out her KQ/KT pair+gutshot equity.

I'm cool with preflop.

I probably lean towards a bet on the flop, especially against non-tricky ABC players (cuz we know we can shut down if called and are less likely to face a bluff on future streets). In these spots where I've hit a pair but there's an overcard on board, I think the more room between my pair and the overcard (i.e. the more vulnerable my hand is) then the more I bet, whereas the less room between it and the overcard then the less I bet (cuz we're closer to a WA/WB situation). I mean, with KK this is a pretty easy check back. But with a vulnerable 2nd pair like here, I think I'm more to attempt to protect my equity in the pot (which is why I'm betting as it's unlikely to fold better / called by worse ETA: although good point above as it's possible she does fold better). Against an aggro player, I'd be cooler with checking back the flop (so that I don't get lets-see-if-he-doesn't-have-an-A-check/raised plus can attempt to get to showdown / bluffcatch for cheap); but she doesn't seem to be this opponent.

Against an ABC player, I'm probably folding the turn even though I weakly checked back the flop, even though it is to a small bet. Even all Jx hands she is betting are beating us. I don't think we're getting played back at with air, although I guess it's possible she's bettig TT-88. Tough spot.

River looks fine to me.

GcluelessNLnoobG

I figured there were benefits to betting flop I wasn't considering.

Mostly because I had played other hands straight-forwardly and I think this would look super strong.

I 3b because I knew the opener was weak because of his bet size and didn't want to just play 'make a hand' poker. Bloat the pot in position against players are going to fold a great deal of the time on the flop or turn when I c-bet.

Do you guys feel that if I am not raising a range approaching 50% OTB when it is limped/folded to me I am missing value? I keep hearing others mention this and I am wondering what you guys think. Does the answer differ depending on whether I am playing online or live?

Oh yes, def different in live. Limping ranges are much stronger in live, so a chain of limps to you is not an invitation to iso-raise. You can raise, but it won't be isolating, since most of them will l/c. then you are playing a bloated pot multi-way with almost zero percent chance of taking it down with a c-bet.

That means that live you should have a much larger overlimping range and play those pots with position and good IOs if you hit a hand. I'd still be raising about 50% if it's folded to you, though.