Hero is playing patient trying to get cards to take advantage of loose nighttime players.

On the button with AJ . Raises to $15 after three limpers.

Two callers, BB and UTG+1. Latter villain has a big stack despite sitting down less than an hour ago. Fairly competent with winning hands, which is the only kind he's showed up with. Doubled up huge with KK v. TT set over set fifteen minutes ago. Hero has $210, Villain covers.

(Forty minutes ago Hero raised AT UTG+2 (?) and Villain called on the button. Hero cbet QT7 flop and two dropped, Villian called. Turn came 9, Hero check-folded, Villain said he had KJ.)

Hand in question: $50 in pot. Flop 8 7 3 .

Checked to hero, cbet $25. BB drops, Villain calls.

Villian seems capable of folding a pair here.

Turn 2 .

Hero bets $80.

Comments?


(Villain checkraises to $160, Hero does not [in actuality] tank.)

"Hero is playing patient trying to get cards to take advantage of loose nighttime players."

Then why are you bluffing with air vs loose players?

You rep nothing other than overpairs, which if the villain does not beat, will say "you got aces? ah you probably do i'll call"

Don't light your money on fire. Stick to your original plan of just value-betting.

C-betting is fine but you can't rep anything with the 2 other than overpairs. Check the turn.

I like the raise sizing preflop as well as the cbet.

I think the turn is a pretty bad card to second barrel, as he is still going to call with a lot of 8's and possibly 7's. After cbetting a flop of this texture we are really looking for some paint on the turn to 2nd barrel, the deuce changes nothing. If he called the flop because he thought he had the best hand, then he still thinks he has the best hand on the turn since the deuce doesn't hit our range at all.

Think I should give up when the turn comes?

This player does not seem to overvalue hands as others do.

Calling the turn with top pair isn't really overvaluing a hand

it is for 80 against a likely overpair.

You can't rep anything with a deuce. Give up, take a free card and hope for an A/J then b/f it.

I don't think multibarrel bluffing on this table is + EV. Just value bet the **** out of them.

Your giving villain too much credit IMO. I mean, I wasn't at the table, but unless you have specifically seen him make at least 2 big laydowns I wouldn't try to "rep an overpair". A lot of times the standard villain in these spots can even put you on an overpair, and still call with top pair.

You have position. Utilize it. This is why it's good to have position. You can check the turn and hope to see some paint on the river and if villain checks to you and you want to try to steal the pot, then that's a much better spot than this turn.

Or think about it this way...If you actually were sitting here with QQ+ and this turn came...wouldn't you be thinking "yes! I can still get value from all his 8's"

And if a K or Q came, you would be thinking "@#$% he is most likely going to fold"

Depends on the player. Against a competent villain I would be glad to keep getting value from an 8 but would do it with a bet of 65 or so.

Good point about waiting for river paint. That's very helpful.

Done w this one vs this villain once he calls flop, sizing is bad I think bc it prices out draws and makes the pot way too big for a 90 river shove to fold out anything.

Those two things go together. Given that villain is competent, I can assume, if he calls, that he is not drawing. Therefore I am not putting any more money in the pot on the river, unless he smalldonks a river J or A.

I don't try to bluff anyone in LLSNL anymore, only semi-bluffs UNLESS I've seen them fold TPGK type hands before, and that's the only time I attempt it. I've learned that people call with middle pair constantly and I just lose significant pots because I was stubborn and that's lighting money on fire.

Who cares if that's obvious, most LLSNL players don't even consider it.

This is not a great board to cbet. Not that you shouldn't try, but when you do try and he calls, you've got to give it up there if nothing changes on the turn.

Why? Because this flop completely misses your range, and your opponent should know it. Plus even if you are ahead with a higher pair or A8 or something like that, there is nothing on the board that says you need to protect your top pair, so your bet looks questionable.

In a position like this, 50% of the time I'm checking here, 50% of the time I'd be firing a c-bet, but dependent on the players. But when I do fire the half-pot cbet and get called down, I'm likely done with putting money in the pot, unless a great face-card drops.

Thanks for the good advice here. I need to shut down a little quicker I think, although I also think I was right that this was a villain not inclined to overvalue a flopped pair of 8's.
Hence in retrospect I shouldn't have been surprised that he checkraised the turn. I folded of course.

I asked if he had the sevens and he said, "No, little ones": a set of threes. I believed him.

Lots of good advice in this thread, but the best is to take advantage of my position after a Villain has shown strength, and play bluffcatcher on the river (after making a hand) rather than bluffer on the turn.

Next hand!

Cbet size sucks and looks like a whiffed flop for TJ+. If you are going to rep an overpair then bet 35-45. Once they call or raise something close to a PSB on such a dry board I'm done with the hand unless an A or J shows up on turn.