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Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains

04-21-2017 , 11:06 PM
I am fairly new to the table, not playing too many hands. Read on villians is a pretty typical loose-passive game. Plenty of multi-way flops and some limped pots, but a raise preflop would thin out the field or steal the blinds (not a game where your raise always gets called by 2+ players). Table is playing a relatively tight game post-flop and there seem to be few showdowns.

Will post this hand "play a hand with me" style

$1/3 NL (9 handed)
Everyone is sitting around $300 including hero.

Hero is dealt 8 8
I open to $9 in MP. CO and BTN call. This should be considered a small raise at this game, and both villains will call with a wide range.

Flop: K 6 3 (Pot $30)
Hero is first to act. Hero?
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-22-2017 , 04:53 AM
First off I would make it bigger pre 5x Imo
I would fire of a c-bet here of precisely $16, because I hate 50% pot bets....but around 15 is good Imo.
Obvious there is an argument for checking here, but I fire two many c-bets with air to not c-bet with a pair here. If I get called I'm pretty much shutting it down though after the flop, unless we bink an 8.
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-22-2017 , 10:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrabbit
First off I would make it bigger pre 5x Imo
I would fire of a c-bet here of precisely $16, because I hate 50% pot bets....but around 15 is good Imo.
Obvious there is an argument for checking here, but I fire two many c-bets with air to not c-bet with a pair here. If I get called I'm pretty much shutting it down though after the flop, unless we bink an 8.
Yeah I agree with the preflop sizing later on I was using $13 pretty successfully to steal blinds or get HU, this was one of the first hands I played
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-22-2017 , 05:40 PM
On to the rest of the hand...

Turn: 6 (Pot $61) (BOARD: K 6 3 6)
Check Check

River: 2 (Pot $61) (BOARD: K 6 3 6 2)
I check, villain bets $20, hero?

Again, I'm sitting with 8 8

I think this might be an easy call against opponents who are tricky/bluffy but wondering what others think. This guy seemed like a standard passive player, and there were no missed draws (45 should be the only draw hand calling on flop and it got there). So it seemed to me he either has a K or he floated me on the flop with a hand like AJ thinking I am C betting with no made hand. I am going to run this through flopzilla to see how close this decision was based on my assumptions, or if it wasn't close at all, assuming he floats me with a worse hand on the flop something like 30% of the time.
Side question: what do others think is a good float percentage to give credit to loose-passive rec players? In general I would think it is closer to 20% HU but this guy bought in for the max and didn't seem nitty.
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-22-2017 , 06:28 PM
I guess another point I forgot when considering how often he will float is he had button behind, so floating is probably non-existent... seem it's safe to put him on KQ/KJ/KT or 45 in this spot but wouldn't mind others' thoughts. Probably the only interesting decision in this hand is what to do when first to act on the flop.
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:32 AM
I think I'd rather open limp, even though this game is playing tight. The key for me is that we're likely going to be OOP postflop and hate most flops; so I'd simply rather play a small pot than a bigger one in this case.

We most likely have the best hand and game has been playing fairly tight with no showdowns, so I'm guessing not a lotta people getting out-of-line. I'd cbet $15 and see if that takes down the pot. Notice how playing in position here how a cbet would typically get us a free card on the turn and get us all the way to the river for a cheap showdown, whereas thanks to being OOP there is a very good chance we might have to check/fold on the turn (which is why I'm not a huge fan of preflop).

GcluelessNLnoobG
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:38 AM
So I'm guessing we cbet and got called by one of the players? And then he let the turn check thru?

Again, thanks to being OOP, even the river is a little tricky. We've tipped our hat that we probably don't have much with the turn/river checks, so now it's unclear whether he is betting cuz we've checked, or whether he has a value hand. 54 did just get there (although unclear whether that would be in the mix at a tight table). 6x got there on the turn (again, in the mix?). Kx was ahead the whole time. You'd think most smaller pairs would simply check behind and take a showdown. Other than 54, there were no draws on the flop. If he floated the flop with air, he didn't bet the turn as a bluff. So overall this kinda looks like a value bet to me. So I'd probably fold; I mean, we're like beating pretty much only 77 who might consider a small value bet.

Overall, these dinky little medium sized pots with mediocre hands add up. Which is why I do my best to play these sized pots in position.

GcluelessNLnoobG
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
So I'm guessing we cbet and got called by one of the players? And then he let the turn check thru?

Again, thanks to being OOP, even the river is a little tricky. We've tipped our hat that we probably don't have much with the turn/river checks, so now it's unclear whether he is betting cuz we've checked, or whether he has a value hand. 54 did just get there (although unclear whether that would be in the mix at a tight table). 6x got there on the turn (again, in the mix?). Kx was ahead the whole time. You'd think most smaller pairs would simply check behind and take a showdown. Other than 54, there were no draws on the flop. If he floated the flop with air, he didn't bet the turn as a bluff. So overall this kinda looks like a value bet to me. So I'd probably fold; I mean, we're like beating pretty much only 77 who might consider a small value bet.

Overall, these dinky little medium sized pots with mediocre hands add up. Which is why I do my best to play these sized pots in position.

GcluelessNLnoobG
Yes sorry we c bet 15 on the flop. CO called with button behind so I am basically eliminating the possibility that he is floating in this scenario. So yes I put him on K or the straight draw- and yes exactly this hand is pretty boring/dinky but because of the fact it adds up over time I wanted to do some analysis on it to see if I could have played it any differently in the long run... I think most of the time I will limp my hand but will mix in the raise from mid-late position. I think I will be c betting almost 100% since in general I'll put CO and BTN on wide calling ranges for this 3x raise, and my hand is not completely air, and if I have the best hand now I'm protecting it. Only thing that makes it a little more difficult is it has to go through 2 players
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote
04-24-2017 , 12:49 PM
I mean, as long as you're not going to butcher postflop then preflop isn't *horrible* (and might even be fine). If you folded the river, I think you played it fine.

GbutwhatdoIknowG
Mid PP on Kxx Board vs 2 Villains Quote

      
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