Hi,
I play live poker in a local card room 1/1$. Usually players are check calling all the time.
Eg: limped pot and it gets checked through till turn 7 way and BTN bets , he usually gets 5 out of 7 callers or something like that .
I just play fit or fold in this game, but I don't calculate odds I'm getting to hit vs stack sizes.
How do I find out if a loose call is profitable in these games?
Eg: I have q4 from BB and it's 6 way and flop is J48 flush draw and I check and One player bets 3/4h pot and he gets 3 callers. I just fold here. But can I call here hoping to win a big pot with trips or two pair? How do I calculate this?
I know I need to get 4:1 or 5:1 on my money , but how do I calculate how much I need to get if I hit my hand to make this profitable the times I hit? I mean implied odds.
Like does the villian have to have 2spr stack or I need to win 'x' bbs when I calling 'y' bbs to make this a good call. I know I can't call if villian is short.

I usually fold 1 card straight draws, bottom pairs, back door flush draw with gutty , etc. I also fold 2 over cards on dry board when one player bets 1/4 pot and gets 5 callers. but im thinking about calling from now on. I'm a very nitty player and players hate me for not giving action. So I decided to give action if I can make profitable calls , also better when I'm in position.

Pretty simple. If you need 4:1 on a call to break even but are only being offered 2:1, you need to make up the other two parts in future betting ON AVERAGE when you hit. This is determined by stack sizes and likelihood of v paying you.

Example: you have to call$20 with a pot of $60 with a flush draw on the turn. Right now the pot is $20 short of what you need to break even. If you think the villain will put in another $20 on average if you hit then its a break even bet. If hell just fold if your flush comes then its a bad bet. If hell stack off for $200 more without a better flush then it has a positive expectation.

From your post it sounds like you're trying to be too systematic. I.e. if I have this strength I call. If I have this strength I fold. Te game is much more dynamic than that. Sometimes ill fold trips to a bet. Sometimes ill call with nothing but a gutter. It depends.

Yeah.. Thanks
I call too, but I just wanted to make sure, I'm not making any bad calls and bleed money because this situation comes a lot .
Eg: I flat mp r with KQ and flop is 584r. Utg bets little less than half pot and 3 callers, I don't know I can call with 2 overs and backdoor flush draw. Stuff like that. Or say I had 22 here.

With KQ you have to calculate your odds of hitting on the turn compared to your pot odds. You then have to decide if hitting your card will win you the hand (not always true) and if you'll make anymore money if you do.

It is VERY rare to set mine after the flop profitably since your odds from street to street are around 5%.

Grunch.

Nah man you got it. Don't change it. Fold bottom/mid pair in multi-way pots like this. The math in these spots is really irrelevant. What's more relevant is whether you will get paid if you hit your outs, or whether or not you out's will make you a hand worth the risk. There are some exceptions where you can maybe peel one off to a small bet, for instance...

If you had like A2hh in the CO in a limped 6 way pot and the flop is like Ts4h2c, EP bet's $5 into $12 or whatever and two players call... But for this to be a call, stacks need to be pretty deep because you are really drawing to a draw, since a heart or 3 or 5 will give you additional out's.

The Q4 example is definitely a fold because when you hit two pair with Q4, you get stacked by QJ and T9, so you have reverse implied odds to hit your hand. Calling a small bet with a hand like QT or Q9 would be more acceptable since you actually have outs to the nuts.

It's also heavily in your best interest to not make these types of calls when you are OOP because the chances you will be able to effectively extract money from your opponents when you hit is greatly reduced.

Low flops like that give the fish a huge advantage. Remember, you are the only one at the table who's range has a lower bound. Expect the hand to be won by 2p at a minimum. So no, I would not call here.

The flush draw doesn't help much because the fish are afraid of flushes. Straight draws, however, are ninja.

It is rare enough to play good cards, hit the flop, and have it stand up.

Hard for me to see how it is +EV to pay to draw to bottom pair medium kicker and not spew more all the times you miss compared to how much you would make when you hit.

The secret to success is to not play like a fish, even if everyone else is.

Calling Q4 in the big blind just because you hit bottom pair is spew.

A4 and K4 have you dominated, as do players accidentally hitting top pair and second pair.

Wait for a better spot, widen your calling and raising ranges when in position.

It is possible to win without having to rely on miracles.

Snip... What an awesome line. It's so true!! So good.