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Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation

10-15-2018 , 07:27 PM
Hero 1/3 live with 350$

Villain is an older man but not OMC. Semi loose, and on tilt. Keeps getting angry he's not hitting flops, says he's down a good bit of cash, and is visibly annoyed. Mumbling to himself about how everybody else always has it, etc.

Hero has gotten sucked out on twice previously with monster hands and hasn't played too many pots. Table has seen them so they shouldn't think I'm playing crazy. Mostly just telling me how sick it was each time (one was my top set vs bottom set all in on flop and guy turned quads that was fun). No reason for anybody to think I've gotten out of line, not 100% sure on my image though.

Hero in MP with 5h7d.

Villain is UTG and not paying attention on his phone. He has not looked at his cards. Dealer lets him know it's his turn and he raises to 8$ blind (doesn't announce it though like some people do I was just paying attention).

Folds to hero, hero raises to 24$.

I think maybe I should make it a little bigger here considering I don't want this multiway. I figure with him raising blind he is either folding which I'm fine with or calling and I can probably get him off his hand on most flops. The other players were casually talking looking uninterested in the hand. If someone 4bets I can easily get away but I'm looking for heads up or to just take it down here. Most of them have been staying out of the way of 3bets.

CO and villain make the call.

Flop (76$): 246r
Villain leads out 15$, hero raises to 45$, CO folds, villain calls.

Turn (166$): 7h putting 2 hearts on the board.
Villain leads out 75$ only has about 170$ behind, hero?

So we had a great board for our bluff pre, but villain is betting into us. I think my raise should be a little bigger on flop though. The turn isn't the best card but isn't too bad. With him betting into me again I'm a little lost here on what he has. We went from only an open ender to top pair+open ender.

I'm thinking mostly either shove or call here. I can see reasons to fold as well. There are many hands he could have here but we still have decent equity. I'm thinking it's possible he may be on a draw or he's just chasing something because he's on tilt. I think if he has a set he's re raising flop instead of flatting then betting the turn. But I also think if he was on a draw he would be checking.

If I call, and a heart comes we can get away from our hand if facing another bet or semi-bluff shove to take it down. We have a made hand although not the best if he checks to us on the river we most likely have a lot of fold equity. I don't think he's checking his flush if he hits it. If I shove turn he may just call me anyway so he can see a river if he is on some kind of draw or 2 pair. So I feel I can take it down easier on the river depending on the card and the action but idk.

I'll post results later.

Last edited by Phraust; 10-15-2018 at 07:32 PM.
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-15-2018 , 07:58 PM
MP is way too early to be making a move with this cheese.

AP flop is fine.

Fold turn.
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-15-2018 , 08:00 PM
Fold pre

Raise flop bigger

Ap ez call
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-15-2018 , 08:36 PM
When people are making blind raises like this, the correct adjustment is not to play back with garbage. When 3-betting light, your value comes from fold equity, and you don't have it against gamblers, they're going to call this with EVERY hand they blind raised with.

Against a random hand open, the correct adjustment is to massively widen your value 3-betting range. MP isn't a great spot to do it from, but you can profitably 3-bet about 30% of hands here if you are likely to get it heads up. 75o isn't in that range.

The rest of the hand is just meh. Flop you either need to raise bigger or just flat. You don't want to bloat the pot just yet.

Turn I think I just call. I don't see much value in shoving, and there are a decent amount of good river cards for you.
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-15-2018 , 10:10 PM
This is total spew. Koss pretty much nailed it, but I can't emphasize enough how bad it is to 3-bet a blind raise pre from MP with garbage against a tilted V.

I would also just flat the flop. We have no fold equity but out implied odds are huge. We don't mind if the CO and button come along. Why are we boating the pot when we have no fold equity?
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-15-2018 , 11:14 PM
Results:
Spoiler:
I called turn, river was Jh, villain checks. Hero shoves. Villain gets mad and says of course it's not the card he wanted and folds.

Didn't think he had a flush or he would have shoved river himself or at least bet. He's not leading flop, turn, and then checking river when he makes his hand. Although it worked this time I figured this was a little spewey esp in MP with such garbage. Maybe with suited connectors but with unsuited gapper it seemed too out of line.
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-16-2018 , 04:32 AM
You are often good on the river here. I think V had air and you got lucky he didn't spaz shove the turn or river on you. I mean, honestly, what value hand do you think you got him to fold that was ahead?

Plan was ultra spew given your PF position. Way too many times someone is going to wake up with a strong hand and flat you, leaving you in no mans land.

Also, PF is a rare instance where an old man could shove on you light with like 88+ AT+ KQ, so like 20% of the time (guesstimating, didn't plug it in), forcing you to give up your position and equity.

That range may be a little wide, but you do not want to pick on tilted Villains. This hand was classic spew versus spew where an old guy didn't have the heart to get all his chips in with air.

Last edited by bodybuilder32; 10-16-2018 at 04:43 AM.
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-16-2018 , 07:39 AM
I'm gonna guess this guy had some type of gutshot with no pair, I think your bet on river doesn't accomplish too much but I agree with your logic that him having a flush is very unlikely so against opponents where you have more FE I like the jam
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote
10-16-2018 , 11:20 AM
For the most part, there's no reason to get out-of-line in most games, plus this is far too early position to get out-of-line, plus at my tables a $24 raise (even though it's technically a 3bet here) will often get called in multiple spots anyways (here we ended up 3ways and OOP, a pretty meh result), plus the old guy is steaming and unlikely to fold preflop (one of the main reasons to 3bet light). I just don't think we pick up enough meta-game +EV here overall to override the -EV we're burning on individual hands like this.

I'm either/or on the flop depending on what we think donker is going to do to a raise. He's steaming, so just don't think he's going to fold all that much, so I probably just call (plus we're cool with other guy coming along and padding our immediate/implied odds). If we're pretty sure this is a donk-to-see-where-we're-at by a guy with a fold Button, I don't mind a raise with our OESD, but here, meh.

This guy just called the flop raise and then donked the turn so it doesn't check thru; ime, this is probably a monster. Probably a sigh call since he'll likely be unable to fold even when our 4-to-a-straight comes in and we're getting better than 3:1 and it's possible we have other outs, but it's pretty meh.

ETA: Also not loving our river play as I'm thinking facing a check that our pair is often good enough simply to showdown, plus this guy is tilting and is just going to call with all his better hands enough just for table sympathy alone.

GcluelessNLnoobG
Made a move with 57o - now in an odd situation Quote

      
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