Hello all, first time poster and long-time lurker. I'm a 23 year old with a passion for poker and am just getting going in the live streets again after an online tourney score. I have a win rate of around 7bb/hr at 1/2nl with a decent amount of volume. No hand histories to share with you guys yet, but I need advice on where to start grinding my live cash games.

Option 1 is a corporate-brand casino with relatively high rake but quite a bit of fish and the games play smaller, which favors my bankroll that isn't big enough (around $3k and building, but not as much of an issue given I don't play full time.)

Option 2 is a local card house equidistant to my home with consistent 1/2 action that plays frankly larger than almost any 1/2 game I've ever seen. This place has on average much more experienced players, but in my opinion most of them play way too aggressive and call down way too light. The pros of this place? $25 club fee upon entry, and that's it for rake. The ability to play 10 hours and pay $25 for the entire day in rake (a dream scenario).

What would you guys do/any advice? I've been at option A at the corporate casino and have done well, but do I need to think about all that rake I'm paying and risk a smaller bankroll at a game that plays a lot bigger?

Thank you in advance for thoughts and opinions. Sorry if I didn't cover any essential information, I would be happy to elaborate with additional questions.

3k is fine for 1-2, for someone in your situation

frankly, if you punt off 3k in 1-2 you aren't able to beat it, so it's better to not have more than that and instead load up $100 and go back online and grind micros and study

the answer regarding where to play is obvious, rake is a massive factor in win rates, especially at lolstakes

only thing is if that club is unlicensed ie a private game/unregulated etc then don't play there, playing in unregulated places is not a matter of if cheating happens but how frequently it happens - if it's an above board place with a sign outside and in the yellow pages then by all means play there

i see a lot of red flags here but going to wish you the best of luck anyway instead of giving a debbie downer speech

good luck and keep your expectations grounded

Ive never been too big on home games because 1) the rules tend to change depending on who is in the hand and how big the pot is. 2) unless you give huge action you will eventually not be invited back if you are that good and aren't close friends with the owner. If something sounds too good to be true...

Sounds from the description that Option 2 is an above the board establishment and not a home game (I.e. doors are open to anyone who wants to play). Agree that rake should be your main consideration. At a casino you’ll be paying north of $15 per hour in rake at 1/2. A flat fee of $25 is an amazingly good deal, way better than what we have at the clubs near me in TX (it’s a $10 hourly fee). The club is the obvious choice.

In poker, live by the saying, "if it is too good to be true, it is." At a rake that can barely cover the cost of the dealer, let alone the other people necessary to run a room or the overhead of the room, I'd be very suspicious. Hopefully, you misunderstood and it was $25 per hour. Otherwise, stick with the regulated room.

For a new player I would suggest the big casino to start with. It will save you from a couple of problems. The constant turn over of opponents simplifies your play because you don't need to worry about balance much or long term meta game issues. The tight casino security will take care of problems with fraud in the games. If you are not that experienced live then playing deep stacked experienced players is much harder then it looks even if they are in too many hands.

You should also need a smaller bank roll at the casino compared to the card house. This will depend on average stack sizes and buy in limits but I expect the casino to be lower.

Once you get more experience then you can try the card room and see how it works.

There is also the issue that the card room seems like a suspiciously good deal. That is a whole separate set of potential problems.

Option A. Sounds like the cardhouse really isnt a 1/2 game but possibly more like 2/5 or even higher which your bankroll cant sustain. If you start ratholing you may get banned too. Improve your game a little, take the less variance route and you can probably increase your w/r at the casino to 10bb/hr. Then maybe after you grind up another 3k you can use that to take a shot at the cardhouse game.

Hey guys, thanks so much for the advice so far. Option 2 is 100% NOT a home game or anything similar to it - if it was I would have no interest in permanently staying there. It's a room open to the public with a sign out front and massive tournament series giving away tickets to the WSOP Main event. I have not been suspicious of any foul play here and they're widely regarded across my city as a good, legit room.

I'm not mistaken about the rake. It's a one-time $25 fee per day, they even give you a discount on rake if you'd played a tournament on the same day.

Hopefully this helps, and thanks for the input so far. It's greatly appreciated

Hey guys, thanks so much for the advice so far. Option 2 is 100% NOT a home game or anything similar to it - if it was I would have no interest in permanently staying there. It's a room open to the public with a sign out front and massive tournament series giving away tickets to the WSOP Main event. I have not been suspicious of any foul play here and they're widely regarded across my city as a good, legit room.

I'm not mistaken about the rake. It's a one-time $25 fee per day, they even give you a discount on rake if you'd played a tournament on the same day.

Hopefully this helps, and thanks for the input so far. It's greatly appreciated

Hey OP,

Whats the average stack size you see in option 2? Whats the normal open raise size? What would you be buying in for?

One of the things that really clicked for me when going through all the CLP content was when Bart said that the size of a game is really determined by those first two factors. I've found it to be pretty true.

If at option 2 people are normally sitting $500+ deep and the standard open raise size is $15 to $20 you really need to treat this as a 2/5 game for bankroll considerations, at least imo.

No matter the rake you really aren't rolled for a game that big and a normal downswing would carry the risk of ruin.

Answer is easy. Obviously play where you'll win the most. Split your time between both places and document your results.

With myriad factors here (rake/buyin/stack size/clientele) you can't just look at these numbers and analyze to get an answer. Of all the factors, clientele(donkeys/whales whatever terms you like) is the biggest determinant.

Split your time between both. Doesn't have to be an either/or problem.

play at the cardroom, just because it plays huge doesn't mean you have to buy in for 1000 or whatever. Just buy in for 100bb and leave when you're too deep

I dont understand the type of place you're talking about but it sounds interesting. Something like that isn't legal where I live but if there are cameras/security and legitimate rule enforcement I wouldn't be opposed.

Is there a cage? How does it differ from an actual casino?

Does either game have caps on the buy-ins? It sounds like #1 does and #2 doesn't. If that's the case, I would start out at #1 where you are a little more protected, then move to #2 when you feel confident. Playing big stacks is the hardest thing to learn in big-bet poker imo, and this may be an opportunity to do it at 1-2.

There is something that nobody is mentioning: the paradoxical effect that larger rake has on the game.

Option 2 is a *lot* cheaper a game to play, in that the only way that money leaves the table is when someone picks up to cash out. This is going to attract a particular sort of player: the kind who cares about the effect of the rake. Option 1 is going to draw the sort of player who doesn't care that much about rake.

The competing rake structures are going to bias the casino game player pool towards fun players and the cardhouse player pool toward regs.

It is much easier to win money from fun players than it is from regs.

Bum hunt/table select at option 1, the other place sounds like a mitt joint straight out of rounders or something, creeps me out just thinking about playing there, yikes.