Quote:
Originally Posted by andees10
ANL you are really misapplying this reciprocality concept.
For sake of argument, lets assume we have the same post flop skills as our opponents in this exact spot.
Just because you think everyone is flatting KQ is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to our decision. We would actually be losing "real dollars" in my made up scenario if we 3 bet because flatting, IMO, is superior.
If you want to justify a play based on why you think it's MORE OPTIMAL, that's fine. I disagree with a lot of your reasoning for three betting, but that's neither here nor there.
My point is, the only thing we are concerned with is making the most +EV play. Bringing in the "no money moves" idea here has absolutely NOTHING to do with our decision in any way.
If that is your true belief, then thats fine. Its wrong IMO, but thats why we have opinions. And why poker is a great game.
Reciprocality does play a role here and if you dont see it, well you just dont see it. If I raise with KQ or AQ or AJ and someone 3 bets from the blinds, it is VERY difficult for me to play him now. But, if he flats and just play s a check call game with me he will never win the hand often without actually making the best hand. This is such an elementary argument that I really cannot believe so many are fighting for flatting.
If you guys who are in the flat camp feel that you can play a hand ANY HAND better by flatting OOP, and playing the check call game where you have NO idea where you stand in the hand, check and calling most of the way and check folding when you miss, then well, i guess that is the way you should play it.
To me, we have a very nice hand that will give us plenty of back up equity when needed, as well as win the hand when each player misses OR doesnt flop a hand big enough to call the whole stack with. By taking control with initiative, you literally will always garner a higher EV than if you play a check call game. And if you flat pre, check call is about the only game you have really.
This is my opinion, I know myself that I can generate far more profit by taking control with this hand, controlling the betting and well as betsizing, and knowing far better where I stand in the hand. To me, for many of you to say that you can flat and play the hand to a higher profit without any of the control that i speak of above, well ok then, thats your opinion.
Its funny to me that so many get angry over these things. They are opinions and why we have a forum.
Last edited by AintNoLimit; 02-15-2014 at 03:26 PM.