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KK vs Maniac KK vs Maniac

04-21-2014 , 01:48 PM
This is my favorite cash game and all players but 1 is a reg for the last 5 years.. Every Sat night. Such a good game that I still go even though Horseshoe Cincinnati PLO is soooo weak.

Game is a .25/50 Min buyin of $20 (most start there) no Max Usually starts at $20 -$40 bi and most rebuy for $100 plus. $2-4 raises called by wide ranges.

Villain is a total rich maniac. 1 of 2 that regularly play the game. Independently wealthy and loves to talk and lose money.

Hero is 35. Owns this game. Makes at least $150 almost each session and has lost in maybe 5 total sessions in 5 years.

Hero (CO) $70
Villain (BB)$90

Hero opens $2 5 handed with KK
Button calls
SB folds
BB calls Pot (6.25)
Flop is
345 rainbow
BB checks, Hero bets $4, Button folds, BB check-raises to $14.
Hero calls. Pot is (34.25)
Turn 5

My thinking is that on the flop he could have a straight, 2 pair, set or a pair/sd combo. I called to see what he does to get a better read on where I am.

He shoves for $54 effectively. As soon as he does, I say "That doesn't make any sense." What do you think and why? Thanks
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04-21-2014 , 02:14 PM
He really could have anything here, my guess is he has a 5 & is playing it pretty terriblyw the shove
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04-21-2014 , 02:14 PM
A5s or K5s maybe
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04-21-2014 , 02:24 PM
A3, A4, even 66-99
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04-21-2014 , 02:35 PM
Against a rich maniac, you should be 3betting the flop for value rather than flatting

He can have tons of overpairs, straight draws, pair+draw
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04-21-2014 , 03:59 PM
Can you ever fold in this situation?
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04-21-2014 , 04:52 PM
Sounds like the kind of guy to call a really broad range out of the big blind, because of the discount.

Stoving a range of 22-99,A2-A6,56,67 you are 49.1% to win.

That surprised me a little; at the table I would have figured I was doing better than that.

It could be better than that; if he barrels the living daylights out of trash like QT or J8.

Giving him a broad range pre, but assuming he only continues with equity, it's a coin toss. And that I think is the worst case scenario.

Given the amount of dead money in the pot, it's a call.

As for your flop play, I don't normally like raising against this type of player. You already mentioned that he scurries away when raised. Guess it depends on his image of you. If he thinks you are a fish, definitely just call and let him value-own himself. If he thinks you are capable of a bluff-raise, you might could get away with it here, because he probably thinks most of your range is broadways.
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04-23-2014 , 12:51 PM
I appreciate the responses. The turn shove was super suspicious. Why would trips, a boat, or a straight shove?
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04-23-2014 , 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke0424
Against a rich maniac, you should be 3betting the flop for value rather than flatting

He can have tons of overpairs, straight draws, pair+draw
Is there more value in calling and allowing him to bluff the turn/river or jam the flop?
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04-23-2014 , 12:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhillyEagles9
A5s or K5s maybe

Would you jam on a turn with trips?

I wouldn't. Based on his actions, I don't think there is a chance he has those hands.
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04-23-2014 , 12:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by paratrooper99
I appreciate the responses. The turn shove was super suspicious. Why would trips, a boat, or a straight shove?
Because he gets called by KK.
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04-23-2014 , 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by beauvanlaanen
Because he gets called by KK.
Enough to be profitable?
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04-23-2014 , 01:16 PM
I don't think you can remove trips or better from his range, but it's still a snap call as played.

If there's a flush draw on the flop I'm shoving over his raise for sure. With the rainbow board it's complicated. What does he put you on after you call? Mostly overpairs. Unless he doesn't really put people on anything... That makes me want to shove still on the flop - hope he puts you on AK, as many players love to do, and call off with any pair.

He probably has few pure bluffs, and plenty of semibluffs, in his flop range which to me means shoving is best as you can get paid off by made hands and shut out/charge his draws some of which have substantial equity.
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