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Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown

03-29-2014 , 06:33 PM
1/2$ NLHE Friday afternoon, full ring
Hero: $380, mid 20's, white, reg. sat with 200$ and won a bigger hand on my 2nd hand. Hero posts one off the button and calls a 6$ raise from EP raise with KJ with 2 callers in between. one blind calls. Flop is Q109 (30$). OR bets tiny, 10$, MP goes all in for 40$, hero calls, OR calls...turn brings Q1096x (150$). EP checks to hero who bets 80$, EP calls, then mucks river when he misses.
Villain: about 400$ early 40s, hispanic, looks like a newb. no history since so early in session

The Hand:
3 limpers to hero OTB with A9 who limps. SB folds and BB checks.
The flop:
75x3 (11$)
EP limper bets 2$ (yes, two). both limpers call and hero raises to 17$. I want to build this pot up, and want all V's to call actually, so I kept it small on purpose. Only V calls.

The Turn: 75x310x (50$)
V checks to hero who bets 30$, V calls.

The River: 75x310x10x (110$)
V checks...Hero bricks and....?

I have a clear thought on what I think about this hand, but I don't want to sway peoples thoughts...I will give my input after a few responses.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-29-2014 , 09:51 PM
Don't disagree with any of your decisions. Your hand is certainly strong enough to raise pre flop. But when I have position I also like to keep people in the pot with the chance of over-flushing someone.

I like the raise on the flop.The $2 bet and subsequent calls show no strength. Anyone strong hand would raise on draw-y board. I like the turn bet size. When you get called I think flush draws comprise most of his range.

When the river puts a second 10 out there and the action is checked to you I would check back. Expect to beat a worse flush draw most of the time. When you lose I expect to see 10dXd.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 12:16 AM
Raise pre. Now check back.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 11:44 AM
Bet $50 on turn.

As played, bet $75 on the river.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 12:08 PM
I don't think I'm betting the river here. His range is filled mostly with flush draws imo.

The holdings that make sense that beat us but won't call a big river bet include a 5d. Something like 5d6d, 4d5d.

Anything else he'll fold when we bet and we don't gain anything.

On the other hand, if we bet and he's got a ten we're obviously losing.

I like getting to showdown cheap here.

Only thing I might change is increasing the turn bet slightly.

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Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 12:16 PM
Limited information indicates villain is probably a calling station. If you wanted to try and just fold out counterfeited 2 pair hands you'd like to keep it small (40-50% of the pot) and if you wanted to try to blow him off a made hand like 88 or Q7 as well you'd want to bet big but since players think in terms of absolute dollars instead of pot odds the pot is probably too small to make either of those plays. Pot the turn if you want to barrel the river.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 02:17 PM
The Ten on the river is a pretty bad card, but I think villain has a hard time calling a healthy bet on the river with just a 7.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBlue11
Raise pre. Now check back.
Idt this is an auto raise pre. really have no idea wo more info.

agree with check back river.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 07:17 PM
We have a strong hand in a limped pot on the button. Whenever its limped to me otb and I want to play my hand I need a good reason not to raise. There's a lot of crap hands that have been limped that need to be punished. As played check back. I probably take the free look at the river though.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 07:33 PM
"YUCK!" to the over-limp, raise pre or fold (actually, just raise).

As played to turn, go closer to pot on the turn, better to eval whether to barrel river.

As played to river, check back. Likely the only hands you can fold out now are ones you already beat.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 07:43 PM
Lol at fold pre if you don't raise.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 07:50 PM
I actually don't hate that idea if you don't raise because the only reason you're limping behind is to hit a hand. Trying to hit hands isn't a good way to approach the game. Well I guess some people are OK with that but you're not taking an initiative to attack and exploit.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 09:17 PM
Limping hands that can make nutted draws is ok since you don't mind dominated draws coming in. Especially if you can't profitably iso a dominated range, or if you risk gettin lrr if there are EP limpers.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 09:24 PM
H2 what is vs stack? Jam otr if stack is less than like 160 behind.

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Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 09:27 PM
If a smalller bet from you like 85 is hella scarry thay may be best.

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Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-30-2014 , 09:38 PM
Against an unknown who's probably a calling station and with decent showdown equity I check back the river.

The hand is wp, but I think we should check back the turn. We now only have 1 over and I don't like semibluffing unless I know the villain has a fold button. The only worse hands he calls with are flush draws and we'll get tons of money -- possibly stacks, if we over flush him anyway. I see very little value in raising the turn.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-31-2014 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulls_horn
"YUCK!" to the over-limp, raise pre or fold.
LMFAO

Worst advice in 2+2 history?
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-31-2014 , 07:20 PM
Pre is a clear raise IMO.

I like the flop.

I like your size OTT, in my experience at LLSNL, for non-thinking Vs such as this one its either a call or a fold, only extreme differences in sizing influence their decision.

OTR, its completely dependent upon our opponent's ability to fold. With so little dead money you are going to need a high percentage of folds to make a bluff profitable.

I'd be checking back primarily because we are against an unknown. These are the spots I struggle with most and can often send me on a tilt-induced dispersion of chips, so I consider the residual effects and opportunity cost of the play as well.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-31-2014 , 08:38 PM
use your position to lose less vs. stubborn pairs and check behind.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
03-31-2014 , 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by troloyolo
H2 what is vs stack? Jam otr if stack is less than like 160 behind.

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Stacks at beginning of hand are nearly 200bb
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote
04-01-2014 , 12:27 PM
I think being in position actually strengthens the Argument to raise pre, people are still calling a 10$ raise. You build a pot in position and you can take it down un improved a lot. As played it looks pretty good. I feel like the river is kinda close, i think he is likely to have a weak top pair type hand or a missed flush draw(which you beat). I think I am ok with checking this back some of the time but I hate it when we are shown a small pair. I like betting 2/3 pot to get a fold from all weak 1 pair hands.
Just sat down...flop NFD line; check vs. unknown Quote

      
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