Hello everyone,

I have been away from the tables for quite some time. I recently came back to the tables as of 4 weeks ago.

I was sitting in 6th position on the table.


Hero has just recently sat down <5 hands he's played. Losses the previous hand of A8 to AJ for about $40. Only hand I've seen yet.

Hero ($270 stack)

Me ($790)


3-5 (300) table.

I'm UTG +1 (this was my last hand of the night as I called my 20 minute time to exit.

I was dealt Jc 10s. I raised $20 (the table except for hero) has all been the same players; very very tight so I took a looser approach.

No calls except for Hero in the small blind.


Flop comes:

10h 9c Jh


Hero (small blind) bets out $25.


I sat and thought about it and I figured that he could have a Q or an 8. I didn't put him on the nuts.... I sat and I pushed.

He sat and thought about it, even asked his friend that was next to him, and the dealer told him no coaching.

He made the call.

I turn mine over... He kept his down. Turn was a Jd.

River was a Qh.

-$265 from the hand.


Any feedback? Was it the wrong push? I was hoping to ultimately pick up his $25 plus the pot and leave, but didn't seem to work out like that.

Any advice or thoughts would greatly be appreciated.


-Chris Wood

I did the best I could to give you a response, but your post is a bit jumbled. Generally, hero is you, and the opponent is Villain.

fold pre OOP with JTo. This is not a short stacked poker hand. Others being tight is not a reason to loosen up pre from out of position.

The hand plays itself once you get to the flop - shovel the moneys in with top two when you are only sitting on 54 big blinds. There are so many cards that crush you vs. their range here.

You would not be asking yourself if this were a bad play had the hand held up.

You got it in with the best hand and lost to a draw, so you are asking whether or not you should fold to avoid being outdrawn? I mean, do you fold AA preflop because someone *might* beat you?

The only thing I wouldnt do is announce when I am leaving or my last hand. And if I really am about to leave, then just leave immediately. Poker is a long term game, if you arent going to stay to win back any losses then just leave right away.

no, it wasn't the wrong push. The push was fine with your stack size.

you should be asking was it the right raise pre

You all are saying it's the right push OTF here when the villain (labeled hero in the OP) bets $25 into a $40 pot and we (hero) put him all in for his remaining $235? How many other people are raising to $235 all in on a $25 flop donk bet into a $40 pot?

As for preflop, I'm a sucker for J10 as well, so depending on the dynamics of the table, your image, and knowledge of your opponents, I'm okay with the raise preflop in EP. But I acknowledge that it can be a big leak.

OTF, I think your raise all in after he donks for little more than 1/2 pot is way too big. You have top two on a very coordinated board with a front door two-flush. Your reraise amount is a vast overbet to any drawing hands, which means that only hands that beat you will call (e.g., flopped straights or sets). The only hand that you beat OTF that might consider calling is two pair with 10 9. And you've given no history to suggest that this villain will call any bet just to chase a naked flush draw.

Without any background for how this villain plays (other than the A8 hand that didn't really tell me anything since you didn't give us the preflop action or runout in that hand), my standard line would be to raise to between $75 and $90 OTF. If he merely calls, you can get the rest of your opponent's stack in on the turn (especially if the card is disconnecting or not a heart, since villain's equity will be drastically reduced with just 1 card to come (or even better, as happened here, paired the board)).

I'm also confused with how you lost this hand. Did your opponent have AKhh or 98hh? Those are the only hands that beat you given the river card. If he did, then when the flop comes out the way it did, you both were getting it all in at some point anyway, both times as the favorite (maybe just slight favorite if he had 98hh). But do you see why your overbet on the flop is a mistake against the villain's overall range (as opposed to what he called you with)?

JTo is a very loose raise in EP. Even if table is very tight most of your loose raises should be MP and LP. The flop over shove is too much. This is an easy board for somebody to have a set or straight so your likely only getting called by better hands and big draws. Raising the pot on such a dangerous flop is better.

You probably lose all of your money in this situation no matter which way you go, once you hit the boat on the turn your not stopping. Your opponent most likely has QJ and won't fold turn either. QQ also beats you on river but it is unlikely here and obviously if villain hit a straight flush it's just a cooler.

LOL at my post - totally neglected QJ and QQ when I posted.

we're a short stack on a dripping wet board and we will probably get looked up lighter than if we were fully stacked anyway.

If you lost the hand on the river, then you were ahead when you put your money in.
And he called it off while he was losing.

That's the essence of good poker.
Nice job, next time don't get drawn out on.

Just shove preflop. Hope all heroes fold.

Lol

If there is a bonus for being chip leader then I'm fine with this play.

I know this OP is a mess, but please remember that there is no trolling of strat threads in LLSNL.

OP, I'm going to lock this up, but feel free to post a new thread. This one just doesn't make sense, with Villain called Hero, references to Chip Lead in cash (makes no difference), results (sort of) given, etc. Please clean it up and repost if you'd like to discuss the hand. If you do, get up to the V's donk bet OTF and then stop.

If I read it correctly, though, the shove is a silly over-bet. No need to go that big to deny odds, and you'll usually get folds from hands that you want value from.