1/3
Hero- 20 year old white male. $350 stack, been playing for 4 hours or so but card dead for the last hour. Probably viewed as tight if anyone has been paying attention.

Villain 1- Early 40's white guy. $280 stack, played pretty tight the first 3 hours but is stuck a couple buyins and opening up a little more. Fires pot sized bets when he has a decent hand, really weak blocking bets if he doesn't. I haven't seen anything contradict that pattern at showdown.

Villain 2- Early 40's white female. $450 stack, called a $15 raise in MP with 2 3 suited, flopped 2 pair, turned full house and tripled up. Recently saw her lay down TPGK (KJ on a K 10 x board) when faced with aggression (she donked and got raised by the button).

Villain 3- Late 20's white guy, playing pretty tight, haven't seen him go to showdown in the ~2 hours since he's sat down. He topped up for $100 more a couple hands ago. $250~300 stack.

V1 raises to $20 in MP, V2 calls. Hero has J 10 on button and calls. V3 calls out of the SB.

Pot-83

Flop-10 9 4

SB checks, V1 bets $25, V2 flats. Hero raises to $100.

Not really a value raise, but I thought I could get a hand with decent equity against me to let go. Something like QJo, or KQx. Definitely a good portion of V2's range in my eyes. I think my raise also gets her to muck Q10 and maybe even K10 with the read I witnessed earlier.

Anyway, good spot to raise or just spew? Comments on raise size?

I like it. You don't want to go to a turn multiway so it's a nice isolation and there are a tone of draws that can call you. You also have position for the turn play and can adjust accordingly to how opponents act on turn if called.

Well, the first thing I have to ask is, if it's not a value raise, then what kind of raise is it? When you say, "I thought I could get a hand with decent equity against me to let go", then you are raising as a bluff.

I don't like a bluff with that board with three other players, and I don't like a value raise with TP and weak kicker; basically your ballooning the pot with a mediocre hand. Plus you've indicated that 2/3 players in the hand are "tight", so why are we raising? With a $100 raise you are basically asking V1 if he wants to play for his stack.

We are getting nice odds (5.3:1) to call the V1 flop bet with TP, let's take it.

Reads would be weak bet by guy into multi way pot, mostly weak top pair type hands with some draws....

V2 call...well it should be strong...but by your discription...range still wide...and you know she can lay it down.

V3... tight not a problem...

I think your raise is fine.

Yes, I'm pretty much turning my hand into a bluff, I understand that

I don't normally bluff into multiple villains. But they seem like they can lay down hands, least some can so maybe this is ok, not a move I make but oh well. Your lack of a 3bet pre makes it tough to put overpairs in your range but it could be a set of 10's. A-10 prob doesn't raise otf, but maybe. They're non thinking players so maybe they'll just fold out and just see aggression. But too many villains imo.

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Yeah, that's exactly why I posted it. Kind of seems spewy to me with 3 other people in the hand, but in the moment with the reads I made earlier, it felt like a good spot. I totally understand what you're saying though.

I probably call in this spot, but this is a creative raise in a decent spot. I like it, wp.

I think if you can get people to lay down JJ-AA, then it's okay, but def high variance and I kind of dislike doing this on the 2 suited board since a lot of people will just call the 75 more (or even worse, shove on you) with a flush draw that has something to go along with it.

I guess JJ-QQ COULD be a small part of their range, but I really discount KK-AA with the way the hand developed. 2 suited board definitely makes it a tougher spot to get folds

I call this "building a big pot with a small hand".

What happened IMO is you played JTs for its suity-connectivity goodness and then hit top pair, weak kicker, and didn't know what to do.

They might lay down better, but not much better. So it's a thin bluff.

Grunch.

How do you feel if V1 re-raises? You would probably want to puke, as you just lit a $100 on fire.

How strong is your hand? You have top pair, decent kicker which is a medium-strength hand. Therefore, I don't understand why you are shoveling money into the pot.

Based on V1's best size, you are probably ahead at this point. But V1 may fire again on the turn with his air or rep the heart draw if it comes in. These are additional bets that you can pick-up.

Why exactly do you want to turn your hand into a bluff?

With his bet size and previous patterns, theres like a 0% chance V1 ever raises here. Def not worried about that at all

Grunching ...

As played, given the reads I follow the thinking. Nevertheless, we still have the SB to get around, who is tight and has called $20 PF oop. I assume if they 3-bet, we're folding. Personally, I think we are bloating the pot with TPBK when in position, and facing one too many players.

PF - I'd fold given effective stack size.

But your raise is allowing him to play perfectly. He is going to fold out his air and only continue on with hands that beat you.

Preflop is on the loose side, imo. Stack against V1 ain't great, although against V2 it's better, but we might only be going 3way to the flop (I'd like more). Although, we will be in good position. But there's also nothing stating that these guys are absolute morons willing to stack off easily. My guess is that calling is leaning towards small mistake territory?

I think I just flat the flop and see what happens on the turn, but I'm passive like that. I just don't see anyone folding a draw here in this big pot and we'll be playing for stacks on the turn (sure hope we haven't misread the situation). We've got a fairly mediocre hand, but the price is good, so I think I try to figure out what is going on by seeing the action on the turn. In the end, I wasn't really playing this hand preflop to hit TP in order to get big money in, so I continue with that plan.

GcluelessNLnoobG

I understand what youre saying, if it was heads up, id probably just flat, but the pot is already ~140 and theres a ton of cards on the turn that is gonna be hard to play against. Plus us calling allows the sb to peel with a ton of hands

Thanks for the reply man, I really value your opinion. Pre felt really close to a fold and it might be.

what's hard to play against is having top pair, crappy kicker in a multiway pot. This is not the flop you were looking for. Just fold it.

Level? Folding is the worst option possible

I would typically fold here in a limped pot pretty easy as the pot simply ain't worth fighting over. But here, there's pretty decent money in the pot, so I'm not willing to fold as quickly. Even though I understand there are a crapload of bad cards for us on the turn, I think I'm willing to stick around (getting 5+:1) for one more street to see what happens.

isn't that a good reason to try to thin the feild. we are in no mans land going 4 handed to the turn. With that price you won't even be sure b/c your pricing in strange stuff, like you hit two pair someone makes a straight type thing. Thin the feild in position. 2-3 handed i would flat ok. But on such a draw heavy board and with such a weak c-bet and call of a c-bet I think we should protect our equity here multiway. I don't consider this a bluff. draws can call, and we at worst its a semibluff in position against opponent who will play straightforward on the turn. If we decide we are behind this will get us a free river card anyways worst case scenario.

I would rather fold that call with so many people in the hand b/c you will be lost on so many turns. If you think your behind fold, but I expect you have the best hand here alot and theres alot of money in the pot already.

this was my thought process to a t. You just explained it a whoooole lot better. I still think we can fold out q10 and maybe even k10 though