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Interesting hand vs LAG Interesting hand vs LAG

08-30-2014 , 02:54 AM
Game is 1/2 with a $5 rock straddle. So basically its like 1/2/5 on most hands.
Effective stacks are DEEP. Heros and villian are both sitting on $700+.
Villian is by far the most active at the table. Loves to bet and hates to fold, but somehow managing to win. No an total donk but definitley someone you cant bluff but can value own easily. For the most part hero has been trying to only play pot in position.

UTG opens to $11
3 callers including villian (CO) and hero (SB) calls.
5 way action.

Hero has AhQs

Flop = Qd6s9s

Checkes to villain who bets $21

Hero reraises to $51

Folds to V who of course calls.
Turn = 4s

Hero bets $100, V calls.

River = Js

Hero checks. V bets $100.

Please check my line of this entire hand.
I feel I made one significant misake on the flop that would have changed the entire course of this hand. Also given the line, consider this river decision. Villian does not have zero bluffs in his range, but for the most part he bets with value. He also sees me as tight and probablly bluffable, but I have not realy seen him bluff much.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gjpure
Game is 1/2 with a $5 rock straddle. So basically its like 1/2/5 on most hands.
Effective stacks are DEEP. Heros and villian are both sitting on $700+.
Villian is by far the most active at the table. Loves to bet and hates to fold, but somehow managing to win. No an total donk but definitley someone you cant bluff but can value own easily. For the most part hero has been trying to only play pot in position.

UTG opens to $11
3 callers including villian (CO) and hero (SB) calls.
5 way action.

Hero has AhQs

Flop = Qd6s9s

Checkes to villain who bets $21

Hero reraises to $51

Folds to V who of course calls.
Turn = 4s

Hero bets $100, V calls.

River = Js

Hero checks. V bets $100.

Please check my line of this entire hand.
I feel I made one significant misake on the flop that would have changed the entire course of this hand. Also given the line, consider this river decision. Villian does not have zero bluffs in his range, but for the most part he bets with value. He also sees me as tight and probablly bluffable, but I have not realy seen him bluff much.
Given the lines taken, you beat too many hands not to call on river.

If I were in your seat, I'd be inclined to raise pre, lead flop, c/r turn because of reverse-implied odds. c/c river to induce.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 12:23 PM
^yeah. You shouldn't relish playing AQo oop on a 4 handed pot. Just my opinion. You might could salvage the situation by raising pre, although you will likely get two callers anyway.

As played you are in trouble. That check raise basically turned your hand face up. Villain isn't bluffing river and I would say you're beat most of the time. You can't fold but I think you got out-played here.

LAGs win with position and reads. You gave him both.

Hate to be a nit, but is it bad to fold pre?
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 12:29 PM
Way too much strange betting and your hand is too good here to give up on river. You won't always have the best flush but the whole reason to check is that a better flush is never folding but a worse one might bet after you check.

Is the $5 straddle on this hand? If so, then 3 bet preflop, the $11 is a weak price setting bet and you should be ahead of everybody. If the straddle isn't in play, then you need to read villain's range. Flatting or raising might be better, and possibly even folding from an EP raise by a nit. On flop, lead flop or check/raise more. Your small check raise almost gives him the direct odds he needs to chase a flush. Turn and river look OK. Turn bet could probably be a touch smaller, $75/$80 works just as well and saves you a couple of bucks when your beat already.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 02:09 PM
What was your purpose in making the raise on the flop?

You're offering the villain direct odds to call if he is drawing. A stronger hand isn't folding getting those odds. A weaker hand isn't continuing to bluff.

You make what looks like a solid value bet on the turn and he calls anyway. Got to call the river, but expect to lose most of the time.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 03:31 PM
Sometimes on 2+2 there seems to be a bias toward assuming the OP misplayed a hand, and here I think the hand was well played.

Preflop: you call AQ from the blind = most reasonable play, folding is super nitty and raising puts a lot of money in the pot out of position with a good but not great hand.

Flop: you have great relative position since you would be last to act after the initial raiser, so checking makes sense. When V bets, you are well ahead of his range, so I think raising for value makes sense. Perhaps I would have made it $65ish but $51 isn't awful.

Turn: I like b/f the turn to hyper aggression, which you did by betting the $100 and V just calls.

River: Now you have 3rd nuts and probably are not getting many worse hands to call, so checking with the intention of calling a reasonable bet makes a lot of sense, as V could be bluffing with a missed straight draw or a counterfitted two-pair. The pot odds are too good not to call.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbqDave
^yeah. You shouldn't relish playing AQo oop on a 4 handed pot. Just my opinion. You might could salvage the situation by raising pre, although you will likely get two callers anyway.

As played you are in trouble. That check raise basically turned your hand face up. Villain isn't bluffing river and I would say you're beat most of the time. You can't fold but I think you got out-played here.

LAGs win with position and reads. You gave him both.

Hate to be a nit, but is it bad to fold pre?
given the dynamics of this game, I think it is terrible.

I am 3! this all day to 65 ish.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 05:52 PM
Quote:
Sometimes on 2+2 there seems to be a bias toward assuming the OP misplayed a hand, and here I think the hand was well played.
The only "bias" going on is selection bias; people don't post hands unless they think there's a good chance they misplayed it.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 05:53 PM
I don't think the hand was played horribly, but it wasn't the best way to play it. As played, you have to call the river knowing you're probably losing, but you're getting 4.5:1 on a call. So as played, I call.

I think there are 2 different ways to play this:

1) Raise pre to around 65 with the goal of taking the hand down pre. If you get any resistance, make a pot-size bet OTF.

2) Call $11 pre. OTF, lead out for around $40 or so. Then on the turn, if you still feel inclined to bet again, the bet doesn't have to be as big as you originally played it.

As I said, you didn't played it horrendously, but you bloated the pot while being 100% OOP.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 06:22 PM
Fold pre. As played you cannot fold Qs for $100.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 06:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay S
The only "bias" going on is selection bias; people don't post hands unless they think there's a good chance they misplayed it.
I disagree. I think people often post hands when the end result was negative, and they wonder if this was natural variance of a +EV play or a genuinely -EV play.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 08:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey913
Flop: you have great relative position since you would be last to act after the initial raiser, so checking makes sense. When V bets, you are well ahead of his range, so I think raising for value makes sense. Perhaps I would have made it $65ish but $51 isn't awful.
I agree that we're ahead of his range now, are we ahead of a range he calls a $65 raise with? Cause if not, that's not a value bet.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 08:56 PM
I'd rather 3 bet preflop. Flop should be a check-call, not checkraise.
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote
08-30-2014 , 10:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtagliaf
I agree that we're ahead of his range now, are we ahead of a range he calls a $65 raise with? Cause if not, that's not a value bet.
Yeah I totally understand what you are saying. But by OP's discription, V has been very active and reluctant to fold, so I do see it as a value bet as V might be calling with a worse Q or a draw. Not many legitimate two pairs in his range (maybe Q9, but that would be extremely loose preflop).
Interesting hand vs LAG Quote

      
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