2/3 200max in Australia.

Last night was ugly for me, at least while I was playing limit, dropping the most in terms of $$$ I had ever dropped in that game. When the game broke, being I changed to 2/3NL. Why does this matter? Because I told one of my friends at the table who decided to announce to everyone that "LOL this guy sucks at the pokerz" so that probably affects my image.

The game itself has been the usual 2am fare in Australia on a Friday night. Lots of poo slinging, and the two players on my immediate right are both pretty freaking hopeless, and played a 3.5BI pot with TPNK vs 2nd pair, good kicker. Luckboxed seat selection. The rest are a mix of kinda solid to pretty passive fish, and the game itself is actually quite passive, though very loose pre.

I have sucked out by tilt shoving jack high pre vs a loose raiser (friend of mine) who snapped me off with A3 (tilt I guess) and I sucked out for around a 160 pot. I then doubled through someone when I got 35cc AI vs AQ on a Ac3h4c for around 260 each...

Anyway, Hero is on the Button (550) in what was either a 9 or 10 handed game.


Limp from EP (1xx) by a relatively solid reg. This is most likely a hand like 22-88, a suited ace etc... Folds to the HJ (150), who limps and the CO (200)(both are the two fish I mentioned) who limps too. I raise to 20 with AThh because I have been pretty tight from the others viewpoint which should fold out the blinds, looking to iso vs hopefully the CO (I had accidently gotten "holecard cam" on his hands a few times, I told him to be careful twice, but he hadnt listened). SB calls (350) which is kinda concerning, but he has been a bit loosish, so not a huge drama yet. BB folds, the rest call so we see a flop 4 ways with around 86 now in the middle...

T94

I have diamonds, so I have TPTK and a backdoor flush draw.

SB leads for 50. HJ and CO both recheck their holecards before calling, most likely gutshots and one pair hands. Hero? And if Hero was to call, plans for the various turncards...

Cheers

Ash

I'd focus mostly on SB in this hand.
He donked in a 4 way pot on a semi dangerous flop.
What type of hands is he doing that with?
Reads on SB are crucial for me in this hand.
We have position so I prolly call flop eagerly waiting SB's turn move.
On turn the pot is 280ish and SB has a PSB left.
If we agree that he is not a total donk and if he ships turn I'll assume I'm beat and I'm folding no matter what hits.
Reasons:
- If he ships blank I'll give him credit for an overpair, 2 pair or anything that beats me, it's kinda hard to imagine a hand that we can beat shoving there or some kind of weird desperate draw shove bluff against 3 more people in the hand with 2 short stacks to boot.
- If he ships a turn that completed a draw I'll give him credit for a made hand that I'm drawing dead against.
EDIT: I didn't consider a situation when our hand improves, I don't fold in that case, so I retract the "fold no matter what hits comment".

If turn blanked and is checked to me I ship it.

If SB checks either blank or a card that completed a draw and donks to the right start betting the situation becomes much more complicated and I can't think about it right now hehe.
Actually I typed all this on a first instict I didn't really analize anything very deep so keep that in mind.

The problem is definately the SB. I do understand that much.

However, with the other two providing a decent overlay with their calls, I wanted to raise. My reasons were I was going to probably have a tough time folding if he bet less then his whole stack on the turn, like 100 into what was 300ish after my call... if it was a complete blank or a diamond... Also, I thought that he has at least some % of Tx's in his range were X was inferior to A on that board, and overall, I thought I wasnt in the worst shape ever by raising before I the board got worse/I got outdrawn etc...

However, Im still not sure if this is right, and Im a lot closer to your line then mine after thinking about it some more...

The problem is the pot is about $220 and Hero has effect max of $350. There are only two cards that make Hero happy (another T doesn't improve his hand unless he's up against 94). You have to decide whether you want to stack off or not.

The SB leads into 3 people with a good sized bet. That's a made hand that wants the field to thin. To me, that means a Tx, JJ, 99 or 44 range. If he call with any broadway Tx and T9, you're a very slight favorite. Remove QT and KT and you become a dog. As for the others, unless they are absolutely hopeless at remembering cards (they look every hand they play), they probably don't have a FD.

Running bad and tilting is not the time to make Hero moves. I'd fold, because it is so easy to talk yourself into you're ahead. If you play, then shove. The reason is that at best, each of them have 5 outs. Combined, they are ahead of you. You need a couple to fold their equity to make this hand more +EV.

The worst play is to call and see a turn. You hate all clubs, K, Q, J, 9, 8, 7, and 6, which is about 3/4 of the deck. If the plan is to fold to betting on the turn, you're better off folding on the flop.

Good points venice but If you decide to stay in the hand , even if you hate 3/4 of the deck you still have the odds to pay 50 bux for a turn no?
What does shove accomplish? It will only fold the SB's hands that we beat while the short stacks are pretty much commited and we have a read that they stack off with mid pairs, they are not going anywhere anyway, regardless if they have draws or any weak made hand.
I count on SB to reveal his hand on the turn so I save some money when I'm beat?
Maybe I'm thinking this totally wrong, very possible, I'm very tired.

Keep in mind my first thought is to folding. If I'm not folding in this situation, then it is because I believe I'm ahead. If that's the case, the pot is big enough for a TPTK to win. I may be ahead of every individual player, but I'm not ahead of them combined. If I can get any of them to fold, the majority of their equity transfers to me. Keep in mind that if the SB has KT, QT or JT, the SB will believe he is still ahead and will bet on a blank against 3 other players. A plan of folding to 3/4 of the deck or if the SB bets on the turn on a blank makes calling on the flop spew.

Ah, the ol' "boat-fold" move.

FWIW I'm in agreement with venice on this one. Fold > shove >>>>>>>>>>>> call.