NL 2/3 100-500. 10 handed

Hero dealt KJ (stack 300) in SB. 3 Limpers including Villain on the button (stacks ranging from 200 - 800, Villain 270). Villain average player a bit on the loose side, semi-aggressive. Hero calls. Big blind checks.

Flop ($15).

K J 4 rainbow.

Hero checks. 3 check behind. Villain bets $15.

Hero?

You should lead this flop sometimes with that many opponents in. As played the risky but higher value play is call flop and see what develops. It gives you a chance for a bigger pot but against that many opponents there are a lot of way the turn can go badly. I generally prefer a raise to $50 now.

Bump it to $45. It's not like we want to lead turn very often if we decide to x/c flop and we are going to get a ton of check backs on the turn. Start building a pot now.

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Thanks. What are ways the turn could go bad? Maybe an A Q or T giving someone a straight but I wouldve thought the villains wouldn’t be on two broadway cards given they limped preflop. I guess they could have limped QT.

I’m always afraid of scaring off money when I have a good hand like this so I often check and try to invite them to lead thinking they have the best hand then maybe shoving the river of things look good so it looks like a bluff and hope they call.

But I’m trying to learn how to play these hands best hence the thread.

What size bet would you place if you lead this flop?

I'd lead flop too - probably around $10-15 to start building a pot. People can call with a super wide range. People think of dollar amounts rather than pot size especially early in the hand so its usually not a mistake to go large early.

Hello everyone! First post here on 2+2 and I'm super excited to start looking at my hand analysis. Please, if I'm wrong or right let me know. Trying to better my game so y'all don't kill me. Lol.

Now for the hand. Given the way it was played, I would be raising to something like 45-55. Kx, jx, and Broadway cards like qt are possibilities but none of them have a lock on the hand yet and you should unless pocket fours limped to set mine. So in my mind I'd want to be piling money in for the kx and jx to call or the Broadway to chase. I doubt if someone flopped top pair they'd fold to just one raise at 3-4x the bet. And we all know how much these fish like to chase.

However, I think you should be leading the flop and allowing more than just one person to possibly get in there if they've connected. Nobody is going to suspect you've got top two after limping in the sb so punish them if they want to chase Broadway or get sticky with a pair.

Ace is obviously the single worse card between possible straights and better two pairs. The real danger with this hand is people calling flop with hands you beat now but can improve on the turn. No single hand is likely to improve but the combined odds of the turn helping one of the 4 is risky. Because they can easily improve to a worse two pair or a draw you will be guessing if you are ahead or not.

Situations to slowplay in multiway pots are few and far between. It's almost always better to bet so you can control the size of the bet that goes in and avoid giving a free card. Now clearly, if there was a raise preflop you'd generally check to the raiser to play in flow, but without a raise preflop, just lead the flop like you would with K9s, QTs, Q9s, 44, etc. I'd bet something around $8 or $10.

Only times to really slowplay the flop are when there are no draws and you have the board crushed like if you have T5 on a TT5r flop or something like that.

I'd always lead the flop. It is very likely that no one has anything, in which case it will probably be checked through. You don't want that, because the flop is the best street to get some value out of marginal holdings especially such as gut shots, 4x or backdoor hands. Furthermore, in a limped pot you can probably get three streets out of Kx.

Now I'd probably call, since it's very unlikely villain has anything that can withstand a raise and I would want to invite other people in. You can then decide to lead the turn, possibly depending on the actual card and how many people are still in. But in general, calling flop and leading turn, as played that is, sounds about right.

Raise pre and make it big. Like $30.

Limp-fests are always fun ... Rule #1, Never go broke in a limped pot!!

What is your image and the image of the rest of the limpers? Do you suspect you will get more callers with you calling first? What are you repping here with a raise that will get others to call? Will this V most likely fold if you lead a blank Turn or get stubborn?

A pot like this is very table dynamic dependent. I agree that if you lead the Flop, maybe $10-12, you could be repping a weak Kx or some other SB type of hand that wouldn't necessarily have raised PF. I would view the SB 'lead' betting range as pretty wide and vulnerable .. which makes leading out here very nice since you are at the top of your betting range. But you also need to have led out in other hands as well in order to attract suspicious callers, that's where your image comes to play.

A SB x/r is pretty strong, either a made hand (set, 2pr) looking for value or a 'big' draw that wants value from limpers. Your range really shrinks with a x/r and you need to know how your opponents are going to view this. Are you raising for 'protection' or for value?

We don't really 'preach' protection here, value is the goal in poker. A pot-sized Flop bet from a B could just be a steal attempt ... so why push him off a potential bluff on the Turn? Sure he could have a PP and Turn a set or hit a Broadway card but what happens if he calls your raise and a scare card hits the Turn? The weakest thing in poker is to check behind a x/r OOP!

I think raising here is a byproduct of online play. In live poker you need to try and make decisions based on table dynamic ... which we don't really have in your OP. We don't know why you are ignoring the other limpers and we don't know how you are viewed by the table either.

I will conclude with that 'standard' poker answer ... "It depends." I like leading out here since it looks weaker from the SB in a multi-way pot, but others will say it looks strong in a multi-way pot. Which is it? Read your table and then decide. I don't x/r here unless I'm pretty sure that I'm going to inspire some action. I'm going to let someone else build my pot until the River. If the Turn checks through HU, then so what. Lead the River and see what happens. A x/r in live low limit means 'monster', especially on a 'medium' Board like this one on the Flop. IMO opponents tend to be more stubborn on the Turn and River .. A Flop x/r just smells of strength without a prior history of aggression.

If the pot stays multi-way after I flat and the Turn is safe, then I'm leading Turn 100% of the time, but I may not HU. If you're going to x/r hands like this you might as well raise PF and get your value into the pot before the Flop hits and then take it down when you lead out post-Flop and they all fold to this Board.

Don't be scared of 'free cards' .. who is calling your x/r? IMO only hands that beat you! If there are some AK or QT hands out there that would've limped but are willing to continue against a x/r, then you should've known this and led out!! Know your table .. GL

I'm fine with the limp.

I'd just donk the flop and start building a pot against pairs / draws and evaluate if I get raised along the way.

As played (and in a spot I'm rarely in), it really depends if he can bet/fold (like a lot of players now do, especially in small pots), and I might just call and donk the turn (not going broke in a small pot, kinda ok with having other weak hands continue that are likely drawing ~dead, etc.).

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