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How to get comfortable playing deep? How to get comfortable playing deep?

04-29-2010 , 01:46 AM
So, Its gotten somewhat common for me when playing 1-2 or 1-2-5 to go from my original buy-in of $200 up to $6-700. Its at this point that I get into the mindset of locking up a win and pretty much tightening up to the point I don't even play a hand. Generally, after i realize it ill just play the rest of the orbit and leave. Its weird to me, but I have no problem losing my initial buy-in of $200, but losing the 600-700 would feel way worse.

I'm really happy to walk out with a solid win like that but I would like to be able to sit and play comfortably with 3-500Bbs or more. I'm assuming its just that that kind of money means something to me and my inner nit takes over.

Any tips? What have you guys done to get comfortable playing deep?

Thanks
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04-29-2010 , 02:07 AM
There are generally very different strategies required when playing deep...are you asking for what kind of adjustments are required as stacks get deep, or are you asking how to play comfortably with multiple BIs sitting in front of you and being worried about losing so much money?

The answer to the former is complicated and will take more typing than I care to right at this moment (but I may return to it!) and the latter is a)don't play scared money b)play deep more often. Those two are all that are required to get comfy with the money. Next step is learning how to play it differently than shorter stacks.
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04-29-2010 , 02:26 AM
yea its more of the latter.

I suppose its just going to take playing more deep and actually losing to move beyond and be being comfortable.

What would you suggest doing differently deep stacked than with just 100 bbs?
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04-29-2010 , 03:02 AM
When playing deep stack poker
1. Hand Values are stronger when stacks get deep. Your opponents are less likely to put 200bb+ without a very strong hand. Stacks may go in with an AA on a J 5 2 board and your opponent can show up with AJ in a 100bb stack game. With 200bb+, your most likely facing sets. When stacks get really deep, you might be required to make some bigger lay downs as well.

2. Against deep stack opponents (assuming both are playing 200bb+), you can make looser calls pre flop against such an opponent. So in a 3-bet pot, you might have to fold PP pre flop with 100bb, but never with 200bb effective stacks. This is because implied odds get greater. This doesn't mean you should start playing junk.

3. With deeper stacks, you can also play more "poker" and make more moves - i.e. bluff, float, river - raises. Hence, you can put pressure on people who scared to lose big money in big pots.

4. Speculative hands go up in value - PPs, SCs. Hands like AJ and KJ (top pair hands) go down in value. Value hands are still value hands.

5. You can 3-bet more against deeper stacks. Do it more in position and against people who fold too much to 3-bets/open too loose.
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04-29-2010 , 03:06 AM
Also, your stack shouldn't affect whether you play tight or not. I used to do the same thing where I would shut down immediately after I've won a few BIs. But I realize that I ended up losing out on value in many situations. It's basically playing with your emotions. You don't want to lose the money that you earned. Stay rational and don't worry about your stack. Just concentrate on making the best decisions.
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04-29-2010 , 05:11 AM
Basically 'Premium' hands and 'Speculative' hand become closer in value...

...If everyone is deep u can play more hands effectively.

***I tend to still stay away from the smaller SC (under 5) because u tend to make the 'idiot' end of everything (which can be very costly.)***
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04-29-2010 , 05:20 AM
Hands which draw to the nuts go up in value - so connectors are more valuable when they make the top end of straights, suited hands are much more valuable when they're suited to the ace. Not to say this isn't true when playing 100BBs, but when you're playing very deep, you're getting much better implieds when you play hands and similarly you'll be facing much bigger reverse implied odds situations when playing 2nd best hands.

Position becomes a lot more valuable. You overcome the effect of position by shoving in a shorter game. You don't have that luxury playing deep.
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04-29-2010 , 06:52 AM
Position is more important the deeper you play. I'd actually tighten up early, but late you can play lots of cards.
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04-29-2010 , 06:56 AM
If u have any friends that are decent poker players (2p2 posters, w/e) set up a home game with 0.25/0.50 blinds and a minimum buy in of $200.
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04-29-2010 , 07:44 AM
agree with most of the above, mainly about playing in position and rio issues. The main key is practice, but if the cash is the issue, then standing up is the best policy
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04-29-2010 , 09:35 AM
Also remember that when you're 4 BI deep playing against a villain who's only got 1 BI, you're back to playing with 1 BI "effectively." So, you can play as normal against them, and just nit up a bit verses the bigger stacks (they're probably doing the same thing).
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04-29-2010 , 10:01 AM
position is soooo important playing deepstacked against good players. Play your position well and it's pretty hard to lose, play it poorly and it's pretty hard to win. You have to tighten up a lot from up front unless you are really talented.

If you don't feel comfortable playing deep, you just need to force yourself to play deep more often and you'll become better mentally dealing with it. I'd play for lower stakes in deep games where you don't mind getting felted as much, then move up as you get more comfortable.
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04-29-2010 , 12:07 PM
I'm assuming that you become timid when the effective stack size is around 300 BBs? Hard to imagine more than 2 other people having 300BB stacks at 1/2. When playing against the big stacks start flatting in position with suited connectors, suited aces, all pairs etc. Don't overvalue TPTK and overpair hands by coming up with a commitment plan "if I call this flop raise and he bets half to two thirds pot on the turn am I going to call? What about the river? What range do I put him on? Does he open limp and then call with hands like QJo or does he only open limp with small pairs and suited aces? If there is a flush draw does he play draws passively or agressively? Does he usually trap with sets or try to get it in immediately?" read about stack-to-pot ratios if you haven't and post some histories on hands where the effective stacks are deep and you are unsure. Finally, remember that your whole stack isn't at risk if they less. Hope this helps some!
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04-29-2010 , 12:37 PM
As far as being comfortable, don't buy in more than you can comfortably lose in your first hand and insta-reload for the same amount without being tilted or pressured in the least. Imo you should be looking to buy in 200-300BI in all 1/2-5/10 games to really maximize your EV vs the fish.

In my experience playing live, deep stacks favor players willing to make bigger bluffs. If you find yourself deep in a game and people keep hammering on you when you're just trying to pot control over and over, and not making other adjustments, it's going to suck. On the other side of the coin, I can't count the number of times I've barreled off because some live nit can't find it within himself to risk ever putting 200+bb into a pot, even if my line makes no sense whatsoever .
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04-29-2010 , 03:53 PM
What about playing on the deep 10/20 cent tables online. Does anyone else think that could be good practice. Also, I feel if you can beat those games you can beat almost anything live through 2/5.
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