hay guys my first post im looking for help for a live NLHE game
Stakes 2-3 Spread and 3-5 spread Cap Game 300 and 500

having trouble with people c-betting me on weak flops and decent wet flops
here is one of the hand for example

game 2-3 Spread game cap $300 bet

Player early position bets $10 folded around to Hero in late Position
Flat calls with AJo Heads Up

Flops Comes 257 rainbow Player C-bets $15
Hero Calls turn comes 257-7

Player bets $25
Hero Folds

at some point with over card on such a dry board Does the Hero Need to Grow Some Balls and Re-Raise on the turn for information ?

I pretty much get scared always thinking they have some sort of pocket pair

Need help anyone have any Counter C-bet tips I can Use HELP!!!!

i don't think raise on turn for information is good... if you think he is bluffing then keep on calling... it's easier with ak than aj but aj still beats plenty of hands... this all depends on the type of player he is, does he 2 or 3 barrel with air?

Against players who cbet too frequently you can float liberally with weakish hands that still have some equity (as you did in your example) and start raising your air to fold him out.

Against players who cbet much too little (indicating they've hit hard) you simply fold unless you flop very well.

Without reads i dont think i'd call more t han one bet. A flop float in a vacuum situation can be fine heads up on such a dry board because a lot of the time hands like AQ and AK are very unlikely 2 barrel twice into an unknown until we get reads that villain is now perceived as an agro machine and thus we can adjust. We could bet this turn card then if villain were to check, but because he bet again, we can't assume he is bluffing. His early position raise and flop and turn continuing range heavily weights towards overpairs like 99+ and until we find out otherwise we can't try and make a different play or else we are burning money. If you are having trouble with this after a few sessions with people you have played with before then work on the observational aspect of your game and take notes of what players are doing when youre not in a hand.

If any terminology confuses you then feel free to quote this post and ask.

Bluff raising flop is cheaper than the turn and you get a similar amount of information. Its a great way to burn money, too, if you have complete air (in this case 2 overs has decent equity to mid pocket pairs). If youre deep, bluff raising this flop is a bit better as it allows you to apply pressure without risk of pot commitment for either player. Also, if you call less often and fold or 3bet more often, you steal the initiative to cbet.

3bet pre. Take initiative.

I would not advocate 3betting AJo readless vs an unknown EP raiser. In fact I'd consider folding pre until I can put this player on a range.

I think WP all in all.

He's monkey betting, you hit the miracle turn, put in a pot sized raise and take it down... If u don't plan on doing this don't call the flop.. U can't just hope to hit a J or check it down... This is what all the others do

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I hope this is a level ("reraising for information"? qua?) but if it isn't....

one counterstrategy is to fold weak hands preflop if you can't find good spots to bluff

You floated the flop ostensibly to take the pot away on the turn. Now the top card pairs so you have an opportunity, not so much to counter the c-bet, but to exploit the player who betfolds. Does your villain do this?

Pre-flop - fold AJo here if stealing from position is not a significant part of your game. You are probably behind an EP raiser's range {AQ+,AJs,10-10+?}. Probably not bad to fold even if stealing is a big part of your game. Call if V is loose/spewy.

Flop - You are way behind V's range now. Fold unless villain is an extreme bet/foldy type. In that case, it is an okay spot to bluff.

Turn - Fold. I don't think you can credibly rep 7-x.

The way we counter c-betting is to first understand some basic concepts in poker which include ranging and perceived image.

Lets dissect your hand and play bit by bit. I apologize in advance, I may sound like a dick (in part because I am a bit of a dick) but the only way I can help is with brutal honesty and I just don't have time to sugar coat my critique.

This post says a lot about your skill level and thought process which I would guess is just typical Level I rec-fish. You don't say anything about villain's tendencies, range, raising frequency, etc. Has villain been raising 2 times per orbit or 2 times per hour or is this his first raise in 3 hours? Has villain been bluffing a lot, splashing around a lot, or has the deck been smacking him in the face and every showdown he's shown a strong value hand? ANd how deep are you guys, what are the effective stacks. The amount of chips behind has a HUGE impact on how a hand should play out because it impacts the odds in question (direct and implied odds).

Then there is the matter of how villain sees you. Is villain capable of profiling you? Does villain think you are a fish, a donk, a nit, a TAG, a LAG, an ABC player, or an unknown? Have you been showing down monsters or have you been check/folding all day like a little biatch?

Back to villain. Has he been talking poker theory at the table? Is he drinking? Has he been berating everyone for their bad play and he's giving poker lessons at the table? Is he a young guy with Beats by Dre headphones and sunglasses and a Pokerstars or WSOP hoodie?

The above is what goes through a thinking player's mind before he decides on what to do preflop. Overtime, the above thought process becomes automatic.

Without the above thought process and observations, it is extremely difficult to make the correct play.

SO let's look at this flat. If you had AA would you have flatted? What about if you had KK, QQ, or JJ? So, what does your flat say about your range? If villain is at all a thinking player, your flat says that you don't have a really strong hand. Similarly, if you are a typical rec-fish player what would villain think you are calling with? Probably Axs, Kxs, broadways, and SCs and SGs like 76s+ and 86s+ and pockets 22-TT, so your range is going to be fairly weak and wide with nothing really strong in it.

Okay, how does this flop compare to your range? This flop will miss the vast majority of your range, so when V c-bets he knows that most likely you missed. But what does your flat say about your hand? Well, typical players would just flat with a set or if they hit the 5 or the 7 and most players would fold if they whiffed completely. If you had 88 - TT you would be more likely to raised for fear of an overcard hitting on turn. So based on the c-bet and your flat, V shouldn't be too concerned because like most rec players you will turn your hand face up on the turn.

And there it is. If you had a set or a 7 what would you have done? The typical rec player would just flat again with those hands. So V can safely bet the turn and know that if you have a boat or a 7 you are flatting and that if you don't you are folding. And that is what you did.

If you wanted to win this hand by floating then you need to have an understanding of your image and villain's tendencies and how villain sees you. If V thinks you are an ubber nit then you can float him to the river and shove and he will fold everything but the near nuts to you.

If you are going to call flop what is your turn plan? Your plan can't just be to flop or turn gin. When you call preflop with a hand like AJ you are going to miss the flop 70%-ish of the time. So can you see why that is a losing strategy.

If V had been raising and splashing around a lot, then there is a really good chance that your AJ is actually the best hand right now. That 7 is actually a pretty good card for you. V's raising range (if he had been splashing around a lot) is probably not going to contain a lot of 5s and 2s. When the 7 pairs it discounts the probability that he has it. So his range should be fairly wide and consist of 90% air balls meaning that our AJ should be ahead against him a good amount of the time.

Since we are getting 3:1 on a call, V only needs to be bluffing 25% of the time in order for our call to be profitable. And if he is raising a lot and splashing around a lot then calling him down with AJ is a +EV play.

However, if V hasn't been raising a lot and/or we know based on observation that he is a fairly ABC player that doesn't get out of line, then we can surmise that his range consists of mostly value hands 88-AA, or hands that are likely ahead of ours like AK/AQ. So against this type of villain we should have folded preflop.

Its not about "growing some balls". that is just randomly clicking buttons. No. You need to make decisions based on the available information and observations you should have picked up on with your time at the table.

this is something most Rec players are clueless about. They do not properly observe, assimilate and process the wealth of information available to them. What does villain look like, how is he dressed, does he appear comfortable, does he talk in poker lingo, how does he handle his chips and his cards, how does he handle aggression, how does he handle shows of weakness, does he bluff when he misses when in position, does he go for thin value bets, does he know what he is doing, did he make a horrific play and get lucky or is he just good and soul reading his villains, etc etc.

All the info you need to know to beat your villains is right there in front of you once you learn how to see it, read it, and assimilate it. You then take that info and use it to make the correct +EV decision.

You can't just make decisions in a vacuum and say, "Ok, i'm going to win this pot" and call preflop with no other strategy then to hope you get lucky and hit your hand. That is losing poker over the longrun.

Anyways, GL and hope you stick around at 2+2. Everything you need to know to beat the game can be found in this website. Read through all the stickies/links at the top of this forum

As played in the example hand, I'm calling flop and turn, and probably folding to a decent sized river bet. I balance all 3 options with AJo here(all dependent on opener). fold>3b>>>flat. Given board texture and bet sizing here, I think you can double float(somewhat reasonable chance to have best hand) and bet any river villain checks. You still have PP's in your range, and villain will have a tough time calling AK/AQ. I like this line a lot more if villain was CO or something. Against most EP openers tho, its probably a fold.

As far as play vs c-bets, its all really dependent villain. Check/raising dry flops vs serial c-bettors can be profitable, tho more often than not you're gonna want some equity.. also you can call down as in the above example vs frequents c-bets. I think most players c-bet way to much in 6max and FR, so im sure you encounter this problem a lot. I would try and see what kind of hands he shows down after c-betting (esp when you're not in the hand). It really ends up being a range war most of the time on flops like this.

OP, dgiharris just handed you pure gold. I hope you don't spend 30 seconds reading and saying to yourself, "yeah, I'll do that next time." He's given you a ton of homework to do on just this one hand.

WOW @dgiharris. Thank you.

I tend to disagree with Dgi alot, but that post is pure win. He basically just handed you the keys on how to think about poker.

As a frequent lurker, dgiharris has always been one of my favorite posters on 2p2. So much good information to think about *thumbs up*

+1 to dgi's post... One of the better posts you'll read on thought process of a winning player.

Lol... Just fold the flop even if you hit an AJ on the turn will you be too happy. Of villain is any kind of nit I fold pre. Suited call all day

Christ dgi shouldn't you make him pay you 5 doll hairs for all that? Although your first paragraph is slightly flawed... He stated been at game for 45 mins... So he doesn't know how many times someone's opened in 3 hours.... But yeah listen to what he said... Play a lot more at 1-2 or w/e lowest is... And write a post in 1 year how you called 200 on the river with king high.. Then you're the man. Fwiw I called a dude with j high the other day, was good (although prolly a very borderline call long term) tilty mcgriddled the guy though into dumping 3k so implied odds good

@dgiharris Epic post! Thank you.

You know everytime I read dgiharris posts I learn something about this game, this guy is a true genius and I swear if I ever saw him at a poker table I would run the hell away from it lol

Maybe this should be a sticky. Or perhaps it already is. Then we can link people it and you dont have to tldr your time every beginners thread