This hand is also posted in my PG&C thread found here: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...l#post36570885

Small, very soft home game I play in. Players are recreational and are there for the fun. Play fit-fold or go to far with weak hands. Used to be a .25/.50 home game but they now moved the game to 1/2. game still plays small as people still buy in for an average of $50.

this hand is between me and my poker friend again. I am raising the button with about 50% of my hands OTB and to the table it looks like %100. (22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q2s+,J7s+,T7s+,96s+ is my actual range). We are playing 6-7 handed and the tables overall agg factor is <1. My friend is the only player that is not a LP or CS. I would label him a thinking TAG.

my image: The whole table is like well he's raising again and my friend made a recent joke about my check and fold button is jammed (not working) and the table is jumping on the joke and adding to it. lots of laughter I am a friendly guy and make jokes about it and basically people think I am either fearless, loose, dumb, reckless, or all of the above. I crack jokes at the table and all that overall fun atmosphere on my part.

me and my friend both have a lot of history together, we basically grew up in terms of poker together from our very first live $1 SNG in high school. We both read the same books, traded strategy, took our first shot at 1/3 at the same time and bad beat stories. We always say we aren't at the table to eat each other but we always end up in some kind of hand it seems like. He has made big calls and folds against me and visa versa.

Hero (BTN): $400
SB:
BB (villain): $500 rebought deep after losing some pots
UTG:
MP:
CO:

Preflop: Hero is BTN with AQ
3 limps, Hero raises to $8, SB folds, BB raises to 24, Hero calls $16

Flop: ($54) 854(2 players)
SB bets 35, Hero raises to $85

Turn: ($224) T (2 players)
SB bets checks, Hero checks

River: ($224) K (2 players)
SB checks, Hero???


So what do you think I should do here given my line? Should I check behind, Or bet? (1/2,2/3,Pot,2x pot?) What is villain calling/folding on this river.

I will post my action and results after a little bit of discussion.

if youre going to raise flop and represent a hand, i think you have to fire on the turn

i think id just call flop though since theres only 6 cards that give you equity - which isnt horrible but with those few outs, id prefer to float and see what he does on the turn.

when you check behind turn, you look pretty weak, i dont know if hes going to fold a hand like 99 to a river bet considering your image and the dynamic you guys have.

need to know what he's three betting.

A river bet might get him off stuff like 99, JJ, QQ (not sure if he 3bets all those). He probably won't fold AK (would he have folded this to the flop raise) or AA. Don't think he can have much else by the river.

Don't shove river. The way this hand played I'd probably call you with a pair of 2's. You are repping nothing at this stage - MAYBE 67 for a flopped straight but I still think you would've bet the turn.

If you had a hand like A8 you wouldn't shove river either because you have showdown value. Literally the only hand I can see that you could have that plays this way is K8 or K5.

Bet turn hard is best, in my opinion.

As played, check back river and give up hand to villain. I know you're trying to put villain on a hand, but you forget how weak OUR hand looks to him so it doesn't matter unless you think he's got 23, or 63, but we beat those hands anyway. Definitely check.

It obviously depends on your dynamic, but I think that calling the flop to float him on the turn is better than raising flop. On a board this dry I don't think he thinks you'd raise an overpair (though I personally think it's a good play for precisely this reason). If you two have a history of light 3-betting both of your ranges are pretty wide here and I just doubt he'll give your flop raise too much credit, since you can't viably have any 2pair combos. Most of the hands he'll fold to the raise you were probably already beating.

I would bet around $125 ott and jam river. As played, giving up really isn't terrible cause it looks like he can call with any pair given the situation. Sizing will be way tricky if you are going to bet. I like a hugely small value bet bluff. Maybe 1/5 or 1/4 pot. You have to consider his range of hands. His range is capped around queens, which may be pretty close to his exact hand. If he'll fold 2nd or 3rd pair off the board to a jam a good amount of the time, then that line would be fine too.

Hey guys what would you do as hero on the river if instead of AQ he had 99 or A8s?

check behind with our showdown value. i dont expect to bluff him off worse considering the dymanic

Well if people are like "lol I'd call with any pair as villain" I was wondering exactly how thin we should valuebet as hero.

edit: wait, bluff him off worse?

oh i think i misread it. re-reading it, it doesnt make sense what i said.

yea he calls the flop raise, so his range is going to be a lot of random weak 1-pair, pocket pairs, and some floats.

considering that range, i dont mind betting 99 and A8 on the turn but i still think river is a check behind as now theres 2 scare cards to most of his range on the board and villain, despite the dynamic, would have a tough time calling worse.

if i raised him on the flop, i'd have to bet the turn. Turn is a brick to my raising range. not sure why would i check the turn.

river: i'd check. if v has no piece of the flop we will win with good A. idk Depends a lot on the dynamic but given your image and that V is a thinking player i think he'd call me with any even mediocre holding i.e. any pair so don't think i'd be able to push him of a better hand, just a worse A which we are beating already.

As played. i'd check the river.

Tougher spot. i think i'd still check back the river. pots preety big, and wouldn't want to get pushed off it with a raise on the river. with this hand our flop and turn action would make more sense imho.

I think defining his 3 betting range is a big key to this hand. If it's mostly pairs when he 3 bets pre, the flop is a fold. If not, the raise is ok.

Your flop raise is so FOS to me anyway. Would you do that with AA-TT? Why wouldn't you flat and let him keep betting?

If you're going to bluff, the time to bluff is normally the turn. But, you got a miracle river card if villain thinks you'd play AK this way.

I still think the right play depends on his 3 betting range and his perception of your calling range, which you haven't really told us.

+1

Why are we raising flop IP and checking back turn????

Do you people even think ahead when you create these lines?

We rep almost nothing with the turn check IMO

AP, I think everyone would agree that this is a check behind. I'm actually not interested in what the results were or what you did on the river (it's not really significant to the hand). I'm more interested in what exactly you were trying to do on the flop/turn with the raise/check behind. You've already spoiled what you may do on the river before you even got there.

Appreciate the discussion guys.

I would define his 3 bet range as KQs+ AJo+ AJs+ 22+ 45s-87s. from that range he is raising the 22-66 and the connectors as a bluff and maybe the once in a while Axs or kxs.

It looks like everyone is pretty much spot on with what he had.

So now that I that I look back at the hand with the raises on flop and check turn, I basically rep nothing. As played from the flop, I would have to bet turn and shove river to play it as if I had a set basically (seems to me the only hands that would flat a 3 bet deep and put money in on this board (22-77 or 45s-78s if I that person is a sicko). I probably wouldn't raise with AA-TT if I flatted his 3 bet I would most likely call him down or value him thinly on river. If I could play it over again I would probably just call his 3 bet pre then c/f float the turn. Or I would just 4! as a bluff maybe.

Thought process that lead me to take a ridiculous line:

My range is wide, especially to the table. friend knows i'm wide so he 3 bets me a little wider than most (range approximation posted above). I know most of his hands were still value but he is capable to take shots with 3 bets hoping to take dead money down, most likely just one time shots. I'm on the top side of my range with AQo but hand plays poor in a 4!/5! situation so I decide to flat his raise pre.

Flop comes raggy 854o so I am thinking this misses his unpaired value hands AJo+ AJs+ and his Axs Kxs bluffs. With a raise on the flop I get these out. It may even fold out some of his weak pairs that miss like 22-33 and 5xs-4xs hands that flopped weakly. I can also be confident I can get a free river to spike the likely best hand. if he donks turn still, I am likely drawing dead so i'm out.

On the turn is a 10 so whats left of his range is his 44-AA and stubborn 45s-87s type hands. I am not folding any of that with a bet on turn and ship on the river so I decide to check.

The river is a K and I thought I just got bailed out a little. Its a brick to the 45s-89s hands and weak flopped pairs didnt improve. his PP's are pretty capped with a check on the river like 99-QQ. I decide with a 2/3 bet, I think i bet $160ish I can fold out the hands except maybe 99,JJ,QQ. ofc all his sets just got me anyway but I can fold out his weak pairs or will have to hero me at least.

Villain check, Hero bets $160, villain tanks.... calls.
Hero opens AQo
Villain opens 99 and tony G's me haha
whole table lol's at me

But overall from this hand I realized that although I took into consideration what he has and did a good job with that, I didn't think about what I was repping. for most of the players level 2 is enough because they are playing their hands but with a good player I have to stay in line with what I rep too. this hand was a good reminder of that.
basically with my line I said I have a set or combo draw on the flop then on the turn said jk then on the river said I have AK. WP to my friend he crushed my tendencies here.