Hero is in MP2 with AcAh, SB and BB post, UTG1 calls, folds to Hero who makes it $12 (table has been raising between $7-$15 at this point).

Button calls $12, SB calls, BB folds, UTG1 folds.

Button and SB are both younger hoodie wearing aggressive players often playing wide ranges and raising. Button recently sat down but has been playing nearly every hand. Hero has a tight image and I've been so far playing tight, have made (but not shown) 1 bluff earlier, and other players have verbally noted how tight and patient I seem.




We go to the flop which comes:

10s3c6s

SB checks, pot is around $45ish ...


Hero bets $45, Button immediately goes all in for around $180 more (Hero has about $140 behind after the $45 raise)...SB insta folds...

Hero?

Bet less on the flop. Call.

yes

Thanks both for the quick reply! I can see the rationale now for betting less on flop , would a bet of like $30ish been sufficient?

The bet aside, can either of you clarify why this is a call when villian shoves here? My thought process was that villian was unlikely to have an overpair as they would have (and had been tending to) 3 and 4 bet things like JJ+ as well as some occasional Ax preflop. Do you both feel villian had like A10 or something like that?

If villain is good and can have TT, 66, 33 or a FD, then you cant win. Having said that, few players are good.

This is a bad board for a tight pre flop raiser's range.

Your c bet is huge and could look full of **** to him

Button is aggressive and plays a wide range, so he is shoving here with a ton of draws - he has a load of NFD combos, he probably has 4 combos of 4/5 suited, he may well have some other FD combos...KQss, QJss, QJss. He can be doing this with A10, K10 type hands.

Of course he can also have a set here, although I'd discount 1010 because an aggressive player might 3 bet that on the button.

You need to call 140 to win 230 more and at that price with all the above potential combos of hands you beat, it's a call

When you have a big pair, raise pre-flop and achieve a stack-to-pot-ratio of 3:1, don't bet/fold in this kind of spot.

His range includes JJ+/AT and plenty of flush draws. By contrast sets make up a relatively small part of his range.

You only need 33.7% equity against his range to break even amd you easily have that.

Maybe if you had started the hand with effective stacks of around 300 or more and the SPR on the flop was closer to 6:1, you could consider a fold.

I make it 140 to win 270 more. But yes agreed. With these great pot odds, folding is a mistake.

+1

hard to lay this down w/effective stack sizes

Agree with others....smaller c-bet and now a call. Smells like 98, 97, 87 of spades to me.

Thanks. As i thought about it more after, you're correct that is smelled like something like this.

I think I would have been more comfortable being the one shoving; not disagreeing with you of course, just verbalizing my thought process which was incorrect here.

Thanks for the input. In terms of his range and his image I assumed he would have raised my initial bet pre-flop with 1010+. I think this is a big spot where I got stuck on his flop shove because I now had no idea where I was in terms of behind or ahead. It really seemed like the classic 1/2 "omg I hit a set" move and perhaps this player was capable of exploiting that.

In terms of the SPR on the flop, I have to consider that if his stack was even smaller (i.e. like $50 or $70) I probably would have snap called. Maybe part of it was me seeing his shove as my entire stack (which is was) and is that going to happen often enough at live 1/2 where villians are shoving stacks close to my size on draws and not sets. If that makes sense? I agree with you on your points but this was part of my thought process which I'm appreciative that your comments helped me see.

Thanks. I actually didn't consider that he could have seen me as full of it on that bet (or maybe thought I had AsKs) although I think my image was tight enough that I probably wasn't just trying to steal the pot quickly.

In terms of the 140 to win 270 (or was it 230?) is that I think I got caught up in worrying about a set. How often is it a set at 1/2 live when they do this and you hold an overpair? was kind of my thoughts during the hand. So for this price on the flop, I'm winning a little less than double my money if he doesn't have a set and doesn't complete his draw. But if this sequence plays out 100 times (assuming same stack sizes and similar board) am I going to come out ahead if more of those times then not are indeed sets?

These are the type of hands I put him on. More so 66,33 which are sneaky small pocket pairs that looser players in late position will gladly call a small PFR on implied odds alone knowing if they spike a set versus a tight player who opened they can often get the pot right after the flop or get it in and often win at showdown anyways. Obviously ruled out two pair, and ruled out JJ-KK as he would have re-raised (although I did have a player like him flat call with AA and lose his entire stack to me when I flopped a set so I guess you never know).


Thanks all for the input, it def helped me conceptualize my thought process a little better and understand where I need to not get pushed off AA in spots where a set might not always be a set. I also have no idea why I didn't make my c-bet a little smaller in hindsight.


That said here are some SPOILERS and why, at least in the moment, I made the play I did:

I ended up tanking and folding. Why? In 1/2 live it's often a set here so I folded so my rationale in the moment. After I folded he said he had a FD/SD so something like 9s8s 7s8s which when looking over it and also feedback here, does make sense given his flat all pre-flop. But if I was wrong about him having a set and he indeed has a set then I'm pretty much beat there. Maybe, and I'm not sure how much credit to give him, if stacks were deeper he would have flatted my c-bet and if the turn was dry I likely would have shoved on him. But in this spot I could reasonably see a set trying to 1.) get max value out of overs like AA while 2.) giving horrible odds in case I had like AsKs or some strong spades.

Standard AA spot on the internet,with the ace of spades it’s s fold without call..so call.

Also 2/3 pot on flop is better as a standard,also vs said villain will keep him wider.

Against these types this is almost always a draw. If they raise to $100-$120 with some behind its a set.

I fit this description for quite awhile and I would shove with some mix of combo draws,NFD and sets...I would never raise with leaving a small amount behind as it looks infinitely stronger.

I would call. You are beating a lot of hands that he could have and you could hold up if he's on a flush draw. You have outs if he flopped two pair. If he has a set, it's a cooler.

2 pairs are heavily discounted due to that board texture. We should not just be stacking off with every overpair and just chalk it up to a cooler if it loses. The ability to get away from top/over pair hands is a requirement at this level.

I believe this is a call because shoving the flop here is a young hoodie type move. I expect sets to be played slow a lot here. I am not totally surprised if its a set, but there are tons of draws in his range thay likely play this way.

If we fold aces we’re folding 100% of our range that isn’t exactly 3 combos of TT, which this OP would probably slowplay by checking.

it's a snap call

Unless it's one of the nits in my game I call every time here. You're often up against A10 or a flush draw.

I guess you got stacked by a set? I'm snap calling and feeling great about it still.

EDIT: Just read the rest of the posts, including your most recent one. NOOOOOOOOOOOOO dude! Can't ever fold this. Even if villain is never bluffing they could easily be overplaying worse overpairs or just shoving a hand like 88 for "protection". I'm sure we've all seen 1/2 players shove over a cbet with a weak overpair on the driest and safest looking flops like 337r.