I was playing $1/$2 live at a casino. Table was mostly loose and passive. I had a pretty tight, quiet image and had not even played a single hand for the first like 5-6 orbits of me sitting down (mainly cause i wasn't getting anything) outside of BB hands which were folded right away postflop, until the following occurred:

Game: $1/$2 NL Holdem
Hero is on the button with $180 and JQ
Villain is SB with $230

Villain is pretty much your typical player trying to emulate televised poker. He was also very loose-passive, although i've seen him make value sized bets out of nowhere on players with things like bottom pair, middle pair on a flush board, etc.

Hand went like this:
Preflop:
First four players limp in. Rest fold to me and I bang it to $15. Villain calls and everyone else folds. Pot is $40

Flop: K5J
Villain checks, Hero bets $20, Villain calls $20. Pot is now $80

Turn: A
Villain announces to the whole table he's going to check in a cocky tone, Hero checks as well

River: Q
Villain says "how much you got left?" Dealer counts out $145 for him. He then announces all in. I tank for a few seconds and finally call. I figured that considering I was literally the only player showing any kind of aggression at the table, if he had either a flush or a straight he probably would have happily played back at me knowing he was gonna get action. Plus if he really had something he wanted me to call he wouldn't have came at me in an arrogant, almost bullying manner.

Based on what is known about my opponent, was this a justifiable call or was folding the better move?

Welcome to the forum, OP. Please don't post results, even in a spoiler, as it biases people's advice.

I doubt any real value hand overbets river here. Lots of busted FDs in his range, many of which have an A or a Q in them. Some of his range is AhTh and AhQh, so even some of his "misses" beat us, but I think we're good often enough to call.

Had he acted like this previously? Is this just his way or did he all of a sudden turn on the Hollywood? If so you can laugh and call. As Garrick said, the only bad thing is that sometimes his bluffs beat you.

I apologize I didn't know, first time posting on this side of the forum. Won't happen again

He didn't take pull the act to this extent the whole time I was at the table but he was making a bunch of very questionable bets and I thought this was one of em.

Another thing I was thinking was that I was new to the table and was pretty quiet so far. I hadn't played a hand the first 6 orbits of me being here and dude probably pegged me as as scared money he could easily bluff off the hand

I'm talking about his antics with talking to the table etc. usually when someone starts acting differently all of a sudden something is different worth the situation. Either they have a big hand where they usually don't or they're bluffing. It's a lot easier to bluff than have a monster hand.

He's talking and making a big bet. I like your preflop, but he called. The board is terrible for you.

Fold.

I wouldn't consider AThh a miss, since it's a combo draw that does get there OTR. Plus, since we rarely have diamonds with our line, Tx is kind of the nuts here so his shove is definitely for value if he does in fact have AT here.

That said, I'm not sure he takes this line with any sort of two pair; it's either missed hearts or some type of middle pair turned into a bluff. Then again, since it's an essentially unknown V, he could very well be doing this with diamonds. I say call since there's a chance he doesn't even overbet shove with a straight, so his range is more heavily weighted toward bluffs, bluffs which are unlikely to be two pair imo since most players view it as too strong of a hand to bluff with.

Ohhh I see what you mean. Yeah this the first time i ever saw him he pull any kind of antic like that

No worries. It just that as hard as people try, if the know the results they tend to give advice that matches the results. And almost no one can avoid the temptation to peak at the spoiler.

Doesn't Caro say Acting Strong = Weakness, except when it's not.

In this case, it feels like he really is strong and is trying to create confusion.

I'm probably not giving him action on the river. Literally every hand except naked low hearts that he could call the flop with has us beat by the river. Seems like he could also be bad enough to do this for value with KQ, thinking it is the nuts. In my experience players that are bad enough to do this aren't making reads on you, they are just playing their hands. Some chance this is 5h6h but I don't think there's enough naked heart combos to justify a call here.

Yes, but he "acted strong" on the turn, and the nuts on the turn is QT, so he has to be shoving that on the river for his story to make sense, since he can't have diamonds with the queen of diamonds on the board. He acted strong on the turn and river and since he likely wouldn't play a set in this fashion, the only strong hand that makes sense is precisely QT. Therefore, if we're using tells to aid our decision, this is a fold. Normally overbets are ridiculously nutted in this type of game, but it does not appear so in this case since he isn't repping many value hands OTT.

How would I actually handle this, or how do I think I should handle it?

There are a couple of ways of looking at this.

1. Psychoanalyze the situation, figure out if he's bluffing or not, and act accordingly.

2. Have a good game plan in mind for 1/2 and stick to it. Search for the "fish with a flush line" post by mpethy, which applies here. Part of your game plan in 1/2 is, you should resolve not to pay off the fish when they "get there."

Yeah, you'll get bluffed sometimes. So what. They say if you never get bluffed, you're calling too much. Which is my point precisely.

First option is tactical thinking, second is strategic thinking. Don't ever get so bogged down in a tactical situation that you lose sight of your strategic goals, for example by stacking off with 2p against the nut flush.

Note, I'm not saying, "don't call" here. Analyze the situation, see if there's a clear solution. And if there isn't, maybe you should disengage and get on down the road. (Which is, actually, what I would do. Normally people aren't playing a broad range of suited cards out of the blinds, unless they think you are totally fos. Should be heavily weighted toward PP and AK,AQ type of hands. So for your average guy I would think flush would be unlikely. But you are at a huge risk of getting coolered by a better 2p. Non-nutted 2p isn't nearly as good as it looks. Who knows with this guy. Wouldn't be surprised if he showed up with 72o. w/e)

Now, as for how I would *actually* handle this, tbh I would get pissed off and quit playing poker for six months.

So. What's your strategic goal when you play poker?

Grunch:

In what universe do even the occasionally spazzy loose-passives overbet this river as either a bluff or while holding a crappy 2-pair?

Answer: very few...fold.

^Exactly. It's not bad to bet into a flush board with 2p if you think you get called by worse. But this isn't a "sucker bet," he wants to play for stacks. It's either the nuts or nothing. Important to remember that laying out that kind of bluff OTR (and calling it) is a zero sum game, it's just so much advertising. If villain doesn't get that, well then good! But it's still not a call.

Sounds like he was trying.... to emulate the doctrines of Ed Miller and doing it rather poorly.

I find that tells are most accurate when the player has been playing a long session, is under a lot of stress when making a decision, tired, or on a bad run. Doesn't even have to be a real bad run. Just a player whose played 6 hrs+ and watched his $600 profit [in a 1/2 NL game] turn into $250 over a relatively short period of time. It is at that time the player isn't concerned with "reverse tells" or paying attention to make sure he doesn't give off any.

Hi , my first time also posting here

From my point of view : you have 3rd pair and not too much invested in this pot yet. This being cash game , I'm sure you could let this one go and wait for a better opportunity where less hands possibly beat you. You could try and recreate this situation later with a much stronger hand to trap him. This being a loose-passive table , keep selecting superior hands for raising pre-flop and value bet alot!
You'll have that money back in your stack in no time