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Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro

11-09-2017 , 11:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
Other than AQ I don't think we get anything we beat in her 3b range to fold
So villain is simultaneously folding everything worse than 9s full to a x/r and calling everything that beats QJ? Well then I guess fold pre because you're playing a literal wizard.
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-09-2017 , 11:31 PM
Yes, my god, we almost got through a whole HH that with a woman without copious amounts of male gaze. How could we ever let a woman sit a poker table without a prompt assessment of whether she pleases or disappoints the male-hetero-penis?!

Last edited by venice10; 11-11-2017 at 09:24 AM. Reason: My thoughts exactly, which is why the posts were deleted
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-09-2017 , 11:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Checkmaker
because you know the old saying "passive play gets the money".

are you kidding me with no check raising range? trust me thats just a weak mentality. think about it. its just so weak to have 0% check raise range you might as well lay down and ask to get the crap beat out of you. calling with your monster hands doesnt make your calling range scary it makes your whole game look weak. ughhh i hate this so much. yuck. im not scared of a guy who could be calling me with a boat or could be calling me with TT. im scared of a guy who could be raising me with a boat or QJs/JTs. That's scary.
Not sure where to even begin here. Poker is situationally dependent and I feel your generalizing my thought process in this hand vs this opponent on this texture to how I approach the game which is simply not true. I don't have a rep as a maniac playing passive. I don't think there's a player in my pool who views me as passive or a winning player for that matter (just the way I like it)

There are plenty of flop textures in this sutation I would c/r on. Like JT7 or KT3ss, 456 etc. flops that hit my perceived range harder than hers.

What do you think a c/r accomplishes in this spot? If she has TT-QQ I get more money letting her barrels than repping a K with a c/r. Let's be real, I rep a K only here with a C/R, she doesn't virtually fold hands that have me beat, and her medium strength hands would put more money in the pot if I don't play back hard. C/r here is just silly in this situation
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-09-2017 , 11:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenHighCallDown
So villain is simultaneously folding everything worse than 9s full to a x/r and calling everything that beats QJ? Well then I guess fold pre because you're playing a literal wizard.
Too results oriented to highlight my specific hand here. Unless she has a King she folds to a c/r and I lose so much from letting her value own herself/barrel out w such a wide range on the flop. Wayyy to many hands that she continues w on turn and river that fold to a c/r
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-09-2017 , 11:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
Unless she has a King she folds to a c/r
Remind me why x/ring GSSDs is bad here?
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-09-2017 , 11:48 PM
I don't have gutters in a 3b pot on this board
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11-10-2017 , 06:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Checkmaker
because you know the old saying "passive play gets the money".

are you kidding me with no check raising range? trust me thats just a weak mentality. think about it. its just so weak to have 0% check raise range you might as well lay down and ask to get the crap beat out of you. calling with your monster hands doesnt make your calling range scary it makes your whole game look weak. ughhh i hate this so much. yuck. im not scared of a guy who could be calling me with a boat or could be calling me with TT. im scared of a guy who could be raising me with a boat or QJs/JTs. That's scary.
I think your x/r range is balanced better on wet flops than paired boards. Wet flops give your opponent room to hang himself drawing dead or tilt call with weak overpairs. They also occur with more regularity than a paired board so stand likely to have some real equity more often.
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11-11-2017 , 01:10 AM
Results?
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 04:36 AM
Quote:
I don't have gutters in a 3b pot on this board
What the....??????????
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 06:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Reader
What the....??????????
Yea I typically don't peel JT or QT OOP in a 3bet pot. Should I
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 06:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
Results?
Tanked for 2 min tossed in a chip and got shown 33
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 06:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
We open UTG flat a 3bet and check raise this flop. Who takes this line without Kx? Flatting keeps our range a bit wider
(this is in response to bluff raising with a gutshotj

Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
Other than AQ I don't think we get anything we beat in her 3b range to fold
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenHighCallDown
Remind me why x/ring GSSDs is bad here?
Forget GSSDs, if V is folding everything but Kx to a C/R, you should be C/Ring your entire range. If youre claiming to have a maniac image, thats what a maniac does on this board, and thats why you can do it with 99, because realistically, AA never folds here, and QQ-TT calls sometimes as well.

Does V fold too wide here or not? because if so, then fine, you have no excuse not to be bluffing here.

Realistically I asked if you were capable of bluff raising here, clearly the answer is no. That inability to bluff raise costs you money here, because V can eaisly exploit you by folding a huge range to a c/r. A 0% C/R range is better than only having a value C/R range, but it isnt good.
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11-11-2017 , 09:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
Tanked for 2 min tossed in a chip and got shown 33
Very nice. Well done.
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomark
A 0% C/R range is better than only having a value C/R range, but it isnt good.
Tomark knows what he is talking about.

fwiw results aside i think you butchered this hand. slowplaying OOP with underfullhouse is just wrong here.
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 02:54 PM
^understood, I appreciate the feedback and yes, that's why I posted because I don't feel like I played it optimally. I just really need more of an explanation why on THIS texture in a 3b pot I should be checkraising anything, I just don't get it
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgReg
^understood, I appreciate the feedback and yes, that's why I posted because I don't feel like I played it optimally. I just really need more of an explanation why on THIS texture in a 3b pot I should be checkraising anything, I just don't get it
you should have a check raising range on every board. you need to be thinking more aggressively. protect your equity. on this board im check raising for a multitude of reasons. firstly we rate to have the best hand and i want to win a big pot with my nutted hands, this qualifies. we dont block any of the strong value hands our opponent could have (a king). if our opponent has a hand like TT-QQ or AA we don't want to let them hit a higher full house on the turn for just a call. We are giving them literally INFINITE implied odds when we're still like 200bb deep behind with a hand we obviously are never going to get away from. there is almost no way to get stacks in without check raising this flop.

also you can check raise this flop if you think villain would fold and since we see villain had 33 here check raising wide should be very profitable. so yeah you should be check raising pots where your opponent has to have trips to call you down. preferably you do it with some kind of out so if you get called you can keep betting it.
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 04:31 PM
You were playing against a player who understand her range but she is also not a pro.

A pro would not be jamming here - it just doesn't get called by worse. Also If her goal was to fold you off 99 exactly - it's a decent play but I don't really think it ideal. Now if she is an absolute crusher - and smashed the 5/T+ games and is just screwing around at 2/5 than by all means - maybe she is really good, but imo I think jamming here with 33 accomplishes nothing except value own yourself while really having no real upside. Your river bet screams strength and very unlikely you are playing your hand like this with a random Kx

You happened to crash into the absolute bottom of her jamming range. 33 should be discounted because I don't think it's an ideal play to be 3betting the BTN with it, and she got some insane run bad to bink a 3 on the river and compounded it to jam and turn her hand into a bluff when she didn't need to. You are never paying her off with worse so her play literally is only designed to get you to fold 99 or K9 which is pretty optimistic at best.

Spoiler:
You run insanely good to get a full double up in this hand. I think there was an insane amount of run good to have this hand run out the way it was, and the fact that both of you made a mistake imo is just amazing and really shows the true variance in poker. Also making 65k a year playing 2/5 is really good but i highly doubt it is sustainable for her considering this hand in question. She might just be on a 1 or 2 year heater.
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11-11-2017 , 04:35 PM
Quote:
you should have a check raising range on every board. you need to be thinking more aggressively.
That's patently not true.

Quote:
Yea I typically don't peel JT or QT OOP in a 3bet pot. Should I
Yeah at least some of the times.
Foxwoods gross deep spot vs pro Quote
11-11-2017 , 04:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Checkmaker
you should have a check raising range on every board.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Reader
That's patently not true.
Even if there is a GTO board/situation where you never check raise (i dont know enough about it to say one way or the other), realistically at low stakes you can almost always exploitably bluff raise, or exploitably value raise with something on every board.

The only counter examples i can think of would be when V has an incredibly small range, like he only 3 bets with AA and flop is AAx, you would fold your whole range (i guess youd call with xx for bad beat if they have one)

And Vs river ship was terrible, thats a call for V alll day, I assume trying poorly to get value from KQ-KT
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