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Flopping trips.. Line check. Flopping trips.. Line check.

04-03-2014 , 09:53 PM
1/2 NL
Hero CO (190)
Villian 1 Dealer (120)
Villian 2 BB (230)


Hero raised in cut off to $7 with 76
2 callers.

Hero's image to this point is aggressive but winning. High C-bet percentage.

Villain 1 is passive but seems obliged to play all his hands on the button, villian 2 is a good thinking reg.

Flop comes Q 6 6

Checked to me. My only real question is whether or not this is a default C-bet? Is deviating away from c-betting on a flop like this when you are c-betting most flops a giveaway of strength?

The likelihood is that a bet here will take it down 90% on this board. Unless villian 1 has a Q, a c-bet will end hand as my read on villian 2 is that he would have donked the flop with a flush draw.

With the intention of making the most value out of the hand, is there an argument against c-betting in general? I find these spots slightly problematic. Too often they result in the c-bet taking it down and then too often a call, followed by a diamond or a queen on the turn leads me second guessing myself.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 10:04 PM
I would most likely C-bet this, Hoping to get value from any Q or flush draw. However checking back against most villians wouldn't be that bad either I guess. I will say depending on how thinking of a player your villians are, they will pick up on strength if you check this board...
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 10:06 PM
You're not getting folds 90% of the time that's pretty crazy

You're getting called by Qx, flush draws, 77-JJ.

Definitely betting
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 11:24 PM
If I'm at a table where I can't profitably bet flopped trips, I would rack up and leave right away.

I would actually open fold my hand face up and leave.

Spoiler:
Ok, fine, maybe if I limp like A2s OTB and I flop AAK I might not bet it for deception or something like that, but pretty much always betting flopped trips.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 11:33 PM
The chances that one of them has a flush draw, a queen, or a pocket pair definitely not 10%. Definitely closer to 25%

Obvious c-bet with your image
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 11:34 PM
I'm pretty new at offering opinions so keep that in mind....

Trips aren't strong enough to slow play.

Give a free card and you're vulnerable to the flush draw, a guy with a Q catching another Q, a pocket pair making a set, even runner-runner straight.

Bet enough to wreck the flush draw, and if the V's fold so be it. Open up your pre flop range and keep cbetting until they wake up to the fact that you're stealing them blind.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 11:50 PM
The time to think about slowing down on cbets isn't when you hit trips with a high card and a flushdraw on board. What good can come of checking?
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-03-2014 , 11:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Czech Rays
The time to think about slowing down on cbets isn't when you hit trips with a high card and a flushdraw on board. What good can come of checking?
Slow play bruh
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 07:17 AM
Bet your entire range here.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 09:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke0424
You're not getting folds 90% of the time that's pretty crazy

You're getting called by Qx, flush draws, 77-JJ.

Definitely betting
The 90% is obviously wrong, although it seems I get folds that often whenever I flop these hands. Just slightly frustrated.


Thanks everyone for feedback.. Obviously see the logic behind always betting trips with an overcard now. If you flop trip queens on a QQ7cc board for example though, is there a case for checking back for deception or is it better to barrel to make draws pay etc?
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 09:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CardDead13
1/2 NL
Hero CO (190)
Villian 1 Dealer (120)
Villian 2 BB (230)


Hero raised in cut off to $7 with 76
2 callers.

Hero's image to this point is aggressive but winning. High C-bet percentage.

Villain 1 is passive but seems obliged to play all his hands on the button, villian 2 is a good thinking reg.

Flop comes Q 6 6

Checked to me. My only real question is whether or not this is a default C-bet? Is deviating away from c-betting on a flop like this when you are c-betting most flops a giveaway of strength?

The likelihood is that a bet here will take it down 90% on this board. Unless villian 1 has a Q, a c-bet will end hand as my read on villian 2 is that he would have donked the flop with a flush draw.

With the intention of making the most value out of the hand, is there an argument against c-betting in general? I find these spots slightly problematic. Too often they result in the c-bet taking it down and then too often a call, followed by a diamond or a queen on the turn leads me second guessing myself.

Yes, you should absolutely C-bet this board when checked to here. I think its pretty much a disaster to not C-bet here. For couple of reasons:

1) Your telling us that you have a high C-bet percentage, and have probably made C-bets with good made hands, draws or pure bluffs. I can imagine a table dynamic now developing into your villains is getting frustrated by your aggresssive play, and they can level themself into you are running over them.

So the chances are you can pretty much prisonrape them here. You would C-bet whiffed AK here right? You would C-bet 99 or 1010? So go ahead and just C-bet an amount that you usually would here, like its nothing to you. You will get fat value from many Q type of hands and flushdraws.

And maybe most important due to the dynamics of your high C-betting frequenzy: your opening the betting on the flop and with that action giving your villains the chance of spazz out with anything. Maybe they getting tired of you and raise you with a flushdraw or a good Q? Maybe they have reached their breaking point now? Who knows. You have created a possibly very valuable image/table dynamic for yourself by your high C-bet percentage, and this kind of flops/hands is where you have a big chance of getting your reward. Here you can simpy abuse your image- i almost gets hard thinking about those kind of flops with an aggressive image and some villains possibly getting close to boil over

2) You dont win a big pot if you dont start building it on the flop usually. Keep betting, and let your villains guess if you are bullying them with air or valuebetting with made hands. More often than not they will come to the wrong conclusion- and eventually make big costly mistakes is my experience.

3) If you suddenly do something extraordinary here and check to get more value on later streets, that could ironic enough make you less profit in the hand. C-betting is the way your villains is used to see you, and it feels "safe" for them. So a check here could in worst case scenario make them suspicious and the alarmbells going off.

Last edited by Gilmour; 04-04-2014 at 09:43 AM.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 09:44 AM
grunch, yes I think you must cbet this board. If you have a high cbet % this is a board that you're going to be cbetting with your entire range close to 100% of the time. You can get value from flush draws, Queens, pocket pairs, and ace high. On these types of boards you can also induce floats, though less likely in this spot since you have position.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CardDead13
1/2 NL
Hero CO (190)
Villian 1 Dealer (120)
Villian 2 BB (230)


Hero raised in cut off to $7 with 76
2 callers.

Hero's image to this point is aggressive but winning. High C-bet percentage.

Villain 1 is passive but seems obliged to play all his hands on the button, villian 2 is a good thinking reg.

Flop comes Q 6 6

Checked to me. My only real question is whether or not this is a default C-bet? Is deviating away from c-betting on a flop like this when you are c-betting most flops a giveaway of strength?

The likelihood is that a bet here will take it down 90% on this board. Unless villian 1 has a Q, a c-bet will end hand as my read on villian 2 is that he would have donked the flop with a flush draw.

With the intention of making the most value out of the hand, is there an argument against c-betting in general? I find these spots slightly problematic. Too often they result in the c-bet taking it down and then too often a call, followed by a diamond or a queen on the turn leads me second guessing myself.
If you are C betting as high as you say this is a slam dunk 3 bet. There is plenty to get value from Qx and flush draws always call. I would only check some complete wiffs and he stone nuts here QQ and 66. Players with high c bets get there value when they hit the flop hard and players get stubborn with top pair etc.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 10:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CardDead13
1/2 NL
Hero CO (190)
Villian 1 Dealer (120)
Villian 2 BB (230)


Hero raised in cut off to $7 with 76
2 callers.

Hero's image to this point is aggressive but winning. High C-bet percentage.

Villain 1 is passive but seems obliged to play all his hands on the button, villian 2 is a good thinking reg.

Flop comes Q 6 6

Checked to me. My only real question is whether or not this is a default C-bet? Is deviating away from c-betting on a flop like this when you are c-betting most flops a giveaway of strength?

The likelihood is that a bet here will take it down 90% on this board. Unless villian 1 has a Q, a c-bet will end hand as my read on villian 2 is that he would have donked the flop with a flush draw.

With the intention of making the most value out of the hand, is there an argument against c-betting in general? I find these spots slightly problematic. Too often they result in the c-bet taking it down and then too often a call, followed by a diamond or a queen on the turn leads me second guessing myself.
If you are C betting as high as you say this is a slam dunk bet. There is plenty to get value from Qx and flush draws always call. I would only check some complete wiffs and he stone nuts here QQ and 66. Players with high c bets get there value when they hit the flop hard and players get stubborn with top pair etc.

Edit: sorry for the double post I only ment to correct a mistake.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote
04-04-2014 , 11:29 AM
With the info you've provided, checking back may be slightly worse than check-folding.
Flopping trips.. Line check. Quote

      
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