Here's a hand from Friday. I was back to 1/2. My text wasn't detailed enough tho, so I don't remember all of it.

I was either sb or bb with kks. A few limpers, mid postion v1 raised to 10, I raised to 25, v2 called, v1 called as well. (should I have sized bigger?)

Flop came KdJd2c, I checked to trap v. I knew it was risky because if d came on the turn I wouldn't know what to do, but I decided to be sneaky. (friend told me later after I 3-bet pre I should not have checked, because it doesn't make sense) v1 bet 25, v2 called, I called. (supposed to raise here?since the whole point of checking is to c/r?) But at that moment I was too worried they both would have folded.

Turn was air, v1 checked, v2 bet 40 I think.. Hero raises? and if so to how much??

Friend thinks a turn raise was necessary and I should have bet or at least c/r otf as well. thoughts?

It takes practice. I always try to start every hand with a read on each V at the table and a read on what each one thinks of me. (Usually what each one thinks of me will be very basic, as LLSNL players tend not to pay much attention, but certain Vs do, so their read may be more detailed than average). I also want to start with a good estimate of every V's stack size, though if he/she has more than me, it's just "covers," since the extra makes no difference.

If I start with that info, I can pay attention to the betting, board texture, etc., with all of that info in the background already figured out.

Obviously, the more that you have down, the more that you can add, but it takes concentration and practice.

Start another thread for the KK hand, please. If we have two hands being discussed in one thread, it gets very confusing.

Also, don't include final action. I edited it out again.

Welcome to the forum!

Some thoughts on why 3b here is better than calling.

An important concept in NL is the ratio of the pot to the effective stack size -- known as the stack to pot ratio or SPR.

Higher SPRs (for example, more than 10) benefit drawing hands such as suited connectors or pocket pairs. A high SPR means there's lots of money to put in after the flop, allowing drawing hands to put in a small amount when they're behind (preflop) and win a lot when they flop big.

Smaller SPRs (e.g. less than 6) benefit hands like AA or KK that are likely ahead preflop, but are not likely to get much better. Hands like AA do very well when lots of money goes in preflop, but less well when lots of money goes in post flop.

So the answer is simple. If you have AA, get lots of money in preflop!

With AA (and other big pair hands), the more money that goes in preflop, the better they do. Ideally, you'd like to get all the money in preflop, since you're roughly a 4:1 favorite over any other hand (except another AA).

Shoving all-in here would have been OK. Not necessarily ideal, but at least OK. You make everyone else either give up all their equity in the pot or put in even more money while way behind.

Calling means that opponents still get to see a flop and perhaps outdraw you.

If you're feeling nervous, shove rather than call. Calling lets them have the best chance to beat you. Shoving forces them to make a decision.

This +1000. Why are you playing 2/5 if you are new to poker? You are going to be one of the softer players at the table for a very very long time. It would be one thing if you didn't care about losing the $, but your posts show losing clearly affects you. Not 3betting AA when you are OOP to a PF raiser who makes it $50?? I'm....just...speechless...That is seriously awful.

So not only do you lack the technical/fundamental skills of poker, but you are also scared money. This is a really really bad combination. Players are going to be lining up to get a seat at your table....

I dont think flatting a $50 preflop raise is awful when its going to be heads up. The reason is that most people who raise $50 have 88-JJ or some other hand that they are afraid to play. A 3 bet OOP needs to be to somewhere near $160. All that does is make most every hand fold. Now if they guy will call a $160 3 bet with AJ, then great, but most people wont.

Flatting pre is fine

Whether or not someone called behind is important because it gives you the odds and its just a simple math problem. Download an equity calculator and plug in the nimbers

Flatting pre is OK if you've come to the conclusion that with 10% of effective stacks in, even OOP you can make more money with AA than by 3betting. What's not OK is flatting pre because you are too gun shy to pull the trigger even with AA.

Very true. If I was gun shy I would be more likely to shove all in pre-flop than to just call.

Ah sorry I don't remember the details so I didn't think it was thread-worthy;p but I will try to come up with more details and construct a thread later.

If you don't think it's thread-worthy, we have a "not quite threadworthy" thread you could post it in.

Thanks, it is a very good point that if I wanted to avoid the variance, I should have shoved rather than flatting. My mindset was that i wanted to put less chip in but after reading all the posts, it doesn't make much sense. I mean, unless I made a ridiculous decision of folding every flop unless an A comes up on the flop.

Wtf is no one going to address this? How can the decision be a binary between those two options? How is folding on the table?

Folding is not on the table, but as far as I'm concerned, neither is calling -- and folding would be better than calling -- especially if you are planning to fold turn if you don't hit. We have 100 bb or less. OP"s question was actually about the turn.

you need a plan when you play a hand. this hand you wanted to not go broke on. right or wrong you can argue that.
but the right thing to do if you didnt want to go broke is to raise a huge amount or even all in pre flop. this way you get to win whats there already and if called you are a giant favorite to win.

overall this hand is kind of a trap for most players. you have a hand on the flop with tons of outs if beat but most times are a little behind but are getting odds to play. so if you play you might as well move in as then you cant make a big mistake later on. and even some times get a better hand to fold.

Just shove flop. You have 13 clean outs if behind and massive equity when ahead. Ray Zee is right you need to plan your hands. Calling OTF puts you in exactly the situation you don't want to face on the turn, folding the best hand to a shove.

And FFS 3 bet preflop. You're not playing 25/50 on Stars, you're an inexperienced player in a 2/5 live game. You need to reduce the implied odds of you're opponents especially when they are more seasoned than you.