background:
1)i bought in for 3k and was by far the short stack
2)preflop raises are minimum 50 and go up to 210 regularly
3) several people are 10-15k deep with each other so theres some crazy dynamics going on
4) most are fish...but not necessarily fish the fit a generic mold

ex. of craziness: old lady opens UTG to 60 with AKo, 5 callers, flops a gutty on 2 tone board QJx. she cbets pot. 2 callers. turn brick she cbets close to pot again. river T that completes the flush. she cbets close to pot again and gets shoved on for close to min raise, & she calls it off and gets shown a flush.

but how could you ever know she had air the whole time until binknig the river?


another quick example. guy doesnt play a hand all night, eventually opens for 60, 2 callers from btn & sb. btn is loose aggressive & sb (i thought) was passive young girl. super wet 2 tone 3 to a straight middling board, check to him & he cbets weak, btn raises slightly more than min & sb calls, original raiser also calls. turn is a complete brick. sb tanks a little and donk shoves for 550 which is slightly less than pot at this point. original raiser snap calls and btn tank folds. sb shows AQss for NFD on flop (no pair & no help on turn). original raiser in MP shows A8o?! which is bare open ender on the 567 flop. river bricks & sb ships over 250bb pot with AQhi. girl states after scooping the pot "well i missed my flush on the turn & i couldnt call another bet so i had to shove 1st myself" ?! wtf?!

These plays are completely crazy...but im getting owned in this game trying to proceed with hands by conventional hand reading & reasoning.

Everytime a hand goes to showdown I am completely blown away to see what kind of weird **** they have...

But its not just a complete lagtard monkey game either...I have seen several people overcall AA preflop in spots just in hopes to backraise squeezers...i have seen ultimate sandbaggers and slowplayers too...

I mean i just cannot make sense of this game...people dont fold too much....but they dont just become stations either and call down...they will raise with complete air and sometimes barrel away...but since we are like 300-400 bb's deep at times i find it tough to call down with my strong 1p hands.

setmining...is also not necessarily profitable due to the fact that the preflop raises are so insanely big.

I dont know how to go about beating this game...its got to be insanely profitable because these people look like and ARE complete morons but the way they think about poker is just so so bad that they are seeming to accidentally make correct plays...im not sure how to adjust my game here...im kinda scared of trying to sqz over a 50bb open and 3 calls...i mean i would have to risk a ton...but yet i cant really be playing any hands profitably except maybe QQ+...it feels like there has to be a better alternative to waiting 5 hrs for QQ+ to beat this game although i know this is going to be the obvious answer...if anyone has some experience in these extreme blown out games please advise....thanks!

uhh, if you're playing 3k and everyone else has you covered, you can profitably call an open of 60 to set mine. as it sounds, it sounds more like a game in which people don't play properly in accordance to the ante (blinds in this case.) basically, you are playing a 5/10 game in which the blinds are actually 2/5. because of the smaller ante, it is correct to play nitty. just remember to know exactly where the aggressive players are and get position on them at all costs as it will enable you to play more hands in position. also remember the rule of 5 and 10. if you can see a flop for 5-10% of the effective stack (with 10% being pretty close to a fold), you can afford to call raises with speculative drawing hands in an effort to double through. for more information, please refer to theory of poker as all of my post is covered in greater detail there.

Wait 5 hours. If someone can play one hand all night and get two callers raising 12bb then its worth waiting 5hours for a hand.

You just need to relax first off. Your playing 600bbs deep. You can call comfortable up to $300 pre. So wait till you get the dealer button and get aggro in position. Cold call in position. 3bet in position. That's the only other way to combat aggression is position.

move down.

While a bit curt (not Kurt), this is the right answer. You're playing in a dream game and not playing. This is going to be a high variance/high reward game. However, I doubt you have the $60,000 in your poker bankroll to play in this game.

When Benny Binion owned the Horseshoe and it was the premier gambling casino in LV, he had a policy that he'd accept any size wager. One day, someone got hot at the craps table. It got to the point where if he remained on a heater, he would have owned the casino. Benny steps in and limits the bet. The guy complains, "I thought your policy was to accept any bet." His response was, "So did I, until now."

Sometimes no matter how good the odds, it isn't worth playing the game. Find a game within your comfort zone.

ok, this seems crazy to me. a 2/5 table???????? where in god's green earth does a 2/5 tabe allow you to buy in for 3k? also, 10-15k stacks? dude what are you talking about. the biggest 2/5 stack i think i have ever seen was like 3k. something seems fishy here. max buy in is 500

This lol
and set mine and nut mine and see how they react to pot sweetening bets.

Uh home game most likely...

There is a game like this near me, but as other posters have mentioned I cannot play in it because of bankroll considerations. It does sound like you are a little overwhelmed by the $$$ amounts.

Ask yourself this question. If this was a 1/2 game and you bought in for 1k with surrounding stacks of 2-3k would you be more comfortable?

cosine on this. this game description has me salivating. its like playing 1/2 or .50/1.00 caliber players who have deep pockets. sounds like some of the Florida casinos 5/10 games i play in when im down there.

Concur with all. I played in a game like this in Europe, and while it is where most of my bankroll came from, I was often sitting with my whole roll on the table. When I found 2+2, I stropped playing there. First thing I learned from the beginners forum and the "best of" archive.

Im not sure about now but it was pretty common at one time to see couple of really deep stacks in Vegas LLNL games. I played 1-3 at the Wynn a couple of years ago between two 50k bricks. Same trip playing 2-5 this kid sat down with a complete rack of yellow (100k) a stack of green and 4 stacks of red. I asked him what game he was waiting for and he looked at me like I was crazy. What kind of Jx0 sits 100k deep in a 2-5 game. In both cases the money may as well have have been in the bank because it clearly wasnt going in a pot. I did add on after watching tourney donk stack off 2 or 300 bb with top and bottom on a Broadway flop.

OPs game is clearly not the same situation. In OPs case, I would probably short stack or find another game because the table dynamic is clearly not working with his current style of play. I dont have the roll for this game but would take 10 $300 runs at a it rather than 1 3k stab.

OBV not used to playing super deep. Fine. Buyin for 100bb and stick it in often.
If you have to, cinch it up when you get 300bb+ deep. Im sure it wouldnt be hard to win like a storm day after day and never get over 400bb in your stack hardly. I wouldnt mind picking up 2 stacks a day in a game like that, even if my skill level forced me to play like a nit.

Why do people want to play tighter when stacks are deeper?

Stop thinking like a fish.

Well I didn't say play tighter LAG in position all day(Button only in this wild game). Its the only way I can consistently win pots. In no foldem holdem smh.

IN Harrington's Cash Game Volume I

he has a section on why playing "tighter" when stacks get deeper works against you.

It's counter-intuitive, but when you are "deeper" hand strength preflop begins to normalize, meaning that there is less and less difference between AK and 87s....

I (still) have yet to read it (major leak imo), but I generally agree.

In normal starting hand valuation (for short, medium and normal stack-depths) there are traditionally 3 measures of hand strength: high-card strength, connectedness, and suitedness.

For deepstack and ultra-deepstack play a fourth characteristic comes into play: a hands "nuttyness". That is, its ability to make nut hands.

For instance, the value of big pairs goes up. 600bb deep they're virtually worthless UI past the turn, but their ability to make nut boats is unparalleled.

The value of small pairs goes down because they make small boats. Eew.

The value of connectors goes up because of their ability to make nut straights.

The value of small suited cards goes down because of their tendency to make small flushes. Yuck.

The value of suited aces goes up because they make nut flushes.

Etceterra.

Alot of casinos dont have a cap on the buy in and min. buy in is like 200$.

the other component to hand strength/value is ranging.

If you play "tight" when ultra deep, you set yourself up to be owned by a thinking player, which is another component of how/why hand strengths begin to normalize as you get into deeper stack play.

Now, TPTK doesn't give you the warm fuzzy on a Ks 9c 6d 4d board in which you bet and villain c/r's you and you are both sitting with 300BB+ and the pot is only 60BB and its the 3rd time in the past hour villain has checked raised you on the turn .

This is where deception/history becomes extremely important which is another reason for why hand values pre start to normalize...

Worst thing you can do when sitting super deep is to play like a nit. You might as well play with your cards face up if your villains are at all thinking players. (of course not saying you are arguing that, just sayin)

I look at it this way: the money hands deep-stacked are, by and large, straights and flushes. Full houses are too infrequent, and even three of a kind is less likely than you'd think to hold up when you're 300bb+ deep. Premium hands are great at making 1-2 pair, but don't often make straights and flushes (and almost never get paid off when they do).

That said, the correct response in this spot is either to move down and not play this game or to get a steak. It sounds like this is a dream game but it's not the sort of game you should be playing if you need to ask these questions.

+1

Move up to where they respect your raises obv.

I have not said this since I have been calling myself a poker player.

When I was recreational player I was the donk raising $35 in a 3/5 $200 game because I want people to respect my raises. Now I see donks raising $35 I never give them any action unless I have a pair in position. I be like, that used to be me, its more to a hand then preflop raises. Or respecting someones raises. Its about the whole situation from start untill the dealers slides the pot. So always plan ahead.