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This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep)

12-31-2012 , 04:04 AM
Table has been super juicy. A lot of action from some bad lags. Putting in a lot of money with crap hands.

MP1- Donkish 20's African American fellow. In the game for a couple hundred. Just lost a decent pot on the river and seemingly tilty. He looks like Ja Rule except I could never picture him rapping. Of course I can barely picture Ja Rule rapping either. Stack $40.

MP2- One of my many marks at the table. He's playing around 60/40. Raising and reraising with absolute trash and getting to showdown with WTF kind of stuff. He looks like Bob Costas in ten years and 30 lb. Stack $$760.

CO- Pretty boy 20's African American guy. He's a mark at thetable as well. Mostly LP, but recently been donking along with everyone else. He looks like Michael Ealy only not nearly as good looking. Stack $118

Hero- UTG. Winning image. Strictly value betting. This table needs no help to generate action. I recently took down a huge pot when I 3 bet and got 2 calls with AA and got it in on the flop against two dominated hands. Stack $900ish

Hand:
Hero open limps 7d7c. Ja Rule makes it $10. Bob Costas raises to $20. Michael Ealy calls $20. Hero calls $20. JaRule goes all in for $40. Costas calls. Ealy calls. Hero mutters and calls.

This feels so bad, but in the momentI was eyeing Bob's $760 stack knowing that he had raised and that he would pay off huge sums if I hit. The other two were just bonus. This can't possibly be good, but my implied odds were through the roof.

Flop- Jc 9d 7s ($163)
Hero checks. Bob bets $65. Michael goes all in for $78. hero calls. Bob calls.

I'm not in much danger of Bob drawing out as I've got him on a decent hand now that he's put significant money in post flop. TT+,AJ+, and maybe QT for the only real draw. The shorty is of no concern to me now.

Turn- Jc 9d 7s 6c ($397)
Hero bets $150. Bob tanks and calls $150.

At this point I'm very confident. I've narrowed him down to JJ+,QJ+,and maybe a random combo spade draw.

River- Jc 9d 7s 6c Qs ($697)
Hero bets $225.

I didn't like the queen since he could have just rivered a set, but I couldn't exactly miss a massive value street against his range either. I sized it based on what i thought KK+/2P would call, and didn't worry about a shove since I couldn't really fold it anyway.

I expect to be flamed on different parts of this hand. It was a massive pot so it needs to be evaluated.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 04:09 AM
Just wondering why you've narrowed down costas range when in his description you've said "getting to showdown with wtf kind of hands" "raising and reraising with trash" ? Seems like he could have a **** ton of hands here .. Would like to hear reasoning.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 04:10 AM
fold to the raise pre, bet flop unless you are certain someone else is going to bet in which case raise, bet bigger turn.

Not noticing that the original raiser is shortstacked is a big mistake -- he's never not shoving after someone raises over him.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 04:11 AM
reasoning- size of the pot. Usually when he'd gotten to show down with his crap it was with 1-2 streets of betting but not for the kind of money we're talking about in this hand. It could be a mistake though. I'm always surprised by what gets turned up at 1/2.

DK- I knew he probably would shove. Even with it, I was getting odds to set mine Bob, who had already raised once. He'd only reraise with a monster hand so i was looking at $40 to set mine two short fish and a whale who was 400BB deep. THat was the thinking anyway.

Last edited by spikeraw22; 12-31-2012 at 04:17 AM.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 05:25 AM
Cliff's: NH

You're well priced in at every stage preflop to call. I don't see any problem there at all.

I like the flop call. It shows a lot of discipline. Against his range to 3 bet pre and not 5 bet over the 4 bet shove, we're pretty clearly in good shape. TT has 6 outs, we're way behind JJ, and way ahead of QQ and KK. His bet is weakish, which may be a made hand just trying to milk worse hands, or it could be whiffed AK or AQ trying to get HU witht he all in guy, or at least thin the field.

So TT is pretty much the best possible draw in a range that makes sense for all of his actions, and, therefore, i don't see any need to blow him out with a raise.

Everybody's sizing throughout the post flop is a little weird. Your turn bet looks too small to me, but at least you got a call.

Your river bet looks too small, too.

I don't really mind the smallish bets that much on the turn and the river, because your thinking--make bets that QQ and KK can call/pretty much have to call--is sound.

All in all, I don't see any significant problems. We can quibble maybe about turn and river sizing, but you were there and I'm not, and if you thought those bets were around the max that QQ would call, I'm not going to second guess those decisions.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:03 PM
I don't see the problem with pre. I'd make these calls all day.

Flop depends on game dynamics, as it checking through would be pretty awful. If you are sure it will be bet, then I like the under-rep to get a shot at Bob's stack.

Turn and river bets seem pretty small, but pot is protected, so I understand the sizing. Is river a b/f or b/c? Given Bob's image I think b/c, but we're not loving it if he comes over the top.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:28 PM
yeah there isn't much to talk about in this hand OP, whats your question if you should call preflop?

post flop there is some debate I guess about bet sizing and I might raise the flop sometimes if I feel these players just aren't folding and I want to bloat the pot.

but other than that there isn't much to say here.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:35 PM
Pre is fine. I like check raising the turn. Opponent has bet into a dry side pot on the flop, the turn card shouldn't have scared him so we should expect another bet which we can raise and get stacks in. If I led and te guy was stationy I would bet about 255 as this sets us up nicely for the river ship. I think he has loads of pairs and gutshots in his range that won't fold on the turn.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 01:58 PM
I'd bet the flop. Gotta get all that $$ in there vs this type of player on this flop
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
12-31-2012 , 07:56 PM
lol every time i read one of your HHs i can never find a single problem right away

Only thing that can really be analyzed is what is most profitable otr. You can determine the most profitable line by plugging in the chance you think he will call different bet sizes and determining what will net you the most profit.

EV=(pcall)(s)
where pcall is the chance you will be called by a weaker hand and S is the size of your bet

We'll assume he calls a bet of 225 100% of the time and a shove 50% of the time.

Betting 225 nets you a EV of 225=(1.0)(225)
Shoving for 492 if he's calling about 50% of the time gives you an ev 246=(0.50)(492)

Shoving is the most optimal line if you think you have a chance of getting called more than 50% of the time. If not, then a smaller bet works best.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 12:17 PM
Because it made me laugh...
Results:
Spoiler:
Villain tanked and called. Rolled over J6s like he had convinced himself I'd be crest fallen. We discussed the hand for the rest of the night to my great amusement. He said he wouldn't have called any more on turn or river which is good i guess, but I think I still could have bet a little more.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 01:29 PM
Lmao.

I figured you had him, but the min 3 bet v. The short stack raiser and all the callers is just priceless.

The goofball hand I was thinking he could show up with was QJ. heh.

don't beat yourself up about the bet sizing. We're always guessing at what the max value number is, and you were probably in the ball park.

NH.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 01:59 PM
As described originally I'm not surprised at all at villains holdings , I don't ever narrow the range of a player like this, they simply dont follow any logic except "oh there is chips in teh pot , i want them so i have to call". I just assume he could have anything that somewhat relates to the board and then consider my holdings, and fire away given I beat most of his massive range which you do and I think you played the hand quite well except maybe a river shove but we are nit picking.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 03:10 PM
Whats the heros description cause the JaRule comment made me laugh pretty hard.

How do they describe you, this should be good.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dentaltech
Whats the heros description cause the JaRule comment made me laugh pretty hard.

How do they describe you, this should be good.
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...d-pot-1247133/
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote
01-01-2013 , 05:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fogodchao
lol every time i read one of your HHs i can never find a single problem right away

Only thing that can really be analyzed is what is most profitable otr. You can determine the most profitable line by plugging in the chance you think he will call different bet sizes and determining what will net you the most profit.

EV=(pcall)(s)
where pcall is the chance you will be called by a weaker hand and S is the size of your bet

We'll assume he calls a bet of 225 100% of the time and a shove 50% of the time.

Betting 225 nets you a EV of 225=(1.0)(225)
Shoving for 492 if he's calling about 50% of the time gives you an ev 246=(0.50)(492)

Shoving is the most optimal line if you think you have a chance of getting called more than 50% of the time. If not, then a smaller bet works best.
Close enough but your hand isnt always good. So you need to consider that the hands making up 50% folds will all be hands you beat. Yea factor in equity.
This is either the bestor worst set mine in history (400BB deep) Quote

      
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