First time poster, long time lurker.

Last night at a 1/2 game at the Holywood Casino in Columbus, Ohio, I faced the most difficult decision of my young poker life, and I would like your feedback on what I should have done.

Hero is a white tired looking 30/m. I have 1200 in front of me after having been sucked out on by the drunk on my right. (Yeah, you're having a great night when even after you lose a 600 dollar pot you still are up 900 on the evening...) I would like to say that I wasn't on tilt but I was and had decided to play one more hand and then leave. I look down at my cards and see Ace Queen diamonds.

I raise to 25 from MP after a couple limpers (I know that is a LARGE raise for a 1/2 game but this table is insane. Two people had arrived at the table about 15 minutes or so prior and matched the big stack at the table, which happened to be me with about 1900. so this is not really a 1/2 game anymore...) I get 4 callers, including the SB and BB and the button who is villain in the hand. I look around at their stacks and besides Villain who I saw had some black and green chips for a stack I think totaling 600, no one had that much behind.

Flop is 10 9 4, two diamonds. SB and BB check and I fire 50. Two callers including the button. Pot is about 250.

Turn is another ten (i forget the suit but there's still only one flush draw on the board). This is a terrible turn card for me duh. SB checks, I check, and Button bets 100. SB folds and I call. Pot is 450.

River is a 7 of diamonds. I bet 200 pretty quickly and as soon as I move my stack of 200 red chips out past the betting line, villain announces ALL IN. I almost throw up in my mouth because I realize how strong a move that is. I then ask the dealer how much more it is to call and he says "he has you covered, kinda laughing." Villain then points at a couple purple chips at the bottom of his stack and dealer says those are 500 dollars a piece. Now, I really throw up in my mouth and basically collapse in my chair. I don't know how I am EVER good here. It's about 850 more for me to call.

You can criticize me all you want for not knowing about these purple chips in advance but my play wouldn't have changed up until this point-maybe I would have bet more on the river but I don't know.

Some important pieces of information

1. Villain is 50ish black male wearing sport coat. He's talking to some people at the table while I'm pondering my decision.

2. I've been playing very aggressively all night but Villain hasn't really seen that because he just recently arrived. He did however see the hand where I lost 600 to the drunk guy to my right. I had not seen Villain do anything of note since sitting down.

3. As I already noted, when he shoved he INSTANTLY shoved.

4. I turn over my cards after thinking to myself for about three minutes and I ask villain "am I good here?" He responds after glancing at the board, "I didn't even know there was a flush possible."

5. After about 6 minutes of thinking things through, Villain calls the clock on me. Floor comes over and says I have a minute left to act.


So two plus twoers, what does Hero do? I'll post results after we have a good discussion.

P.S. I recognize how strong Villain's shove is and my first thought was obviously I'm NEVER good here so I should just fold and leave the table. But there was a lot of money at stake so I felt like I should think it through.

Welcome to the forum. I call here, and expect to see mostly lower flushes and trip tens, with few boats and air. Why? Because boats would usually stop to think how much more they can get out of you. An insta-shove make little sense.

Of course, that's easy to say on a forum, but hard to do in game.

Isn't the insta-shove generally thought of as a sign of weakness?

Think a call is in order here too (and promptly see 10-9)

lol snap fold this river

you need to know what you are going to do before you bet

FWIW assuming your A/Q is never good you are getting 3.5:1 direct odds OTT and are 5:1 to hit your FD which may or may not be good. The only way you should really call the turn is if you think his hand is face up as Tx and he will call all river bets but not raise or you are willing to bet/call the river.

I mean it sounds ridiculous to ch/f the turn but it isn't a terrible decision.

Chasing draws on paired boards is usually a bad idea, especially when its this multiway. Odds are meaningless.

Also I would have taken a hella weak c/c line otr. Let villain value own himself with trips or a lower flush.

As played, normally I would say this is a b/f, but I had the same thoughts Garrick had, it really would be a strange line to overjam the nuts here. His "I didn't realize the flush was out there" is total BS, don't know how to read into it though.

Also, I know you called yourself out, but you should have a radar on other people's stacks. Kinda tilts me he had them on the bottom as that's a common angle.

Call. There's lots of trips hands and there's the chance he's being impetuous with what feels to him like play money or house money. He must have gone off at the craps tale or something.

Too big an opportunity to fold.

I think it is ridiculously bad to just give up on the turn. If an ace or queen hits on the river I'll check call some of the time. If a diamond falls then I figure I'll bet and villain will fold or call the vast majority of the time.

If he doesn't boat up and I hit my flush on the river, he most likely is going to call a healthy bet from me. People have a hard time laying down trips....

Also bet more on the flop

dude the turn is like the worst card in the deck and barreling here is bad

no kidding. that's why I checked but I don't think checking is the same thing as giving up.

On flop villain only calls and then you have one of the blinds call.

This flop is draw heavy. So why doesn't he raise to protect his hand?

Turn pairs top pair both OOP check to him he makes a smallish bet. What is he protecting with this small bet? I think he's giving himself good odds for his draw.

River is a 7 completing the J8 or random 8d6d. He doesn't even think. Meaning he hit his hand. I believe from the information you gave he has smaller flush or straight. Now was the ten on flop a diamond? If not, he very well could have ten of diamonds and flush draw turning trips with his flush draw.

So I believe he had a sort of combo draw straight and flush or pair and flush (assuming ten wasn't a diamond but even then he could have suited connector and paired the 9 or smaller card on flop that wasn't a diamond).

I would call here despite being so deep. If he slow played a set and filled up on turn and bet out giving you odds to catch your flush even though you're drawing dead good for him but I don't think that's a large part of his range here. Mostly straights and flushes and air. If he had full house GG.

The only "live tell" that scares me it seems he is acting super comfy but without more info I still call.

Its a math problem dude, do the math. If you are planning on ch/folding every time you miss you need to be called a huge 100% of the time when you hit to turn a profit.

Also the river bet sizing is ****, bet more but unless the guy is a legit "maniac" you are almost never good when he ships.

Why do you assume my Ace high doesn't win some percentage of the time when I miss? And when I miss and so does he, is he always firing on the river?

Why do you assume my Ace and Queen are never good here?

check/folding turn is disciplined, but i struggle to make it because omg i can make the best flush possible. river is a clear bet/fold. i personally don't find the insta shove to be a bluff that often, and i play at the above casino.

i assume the ace and queen are never good here because check/calling having paired my ace or queen is suicidal. therefore, the only time they're actually going to be good is if the river goes check/check.

You have given no reads so I am assuming villain is your general loose passive opponent who don't bluff a high frequency (or he is a huge nit) and yes I would assume that he is firing most rivers because he doesn't have a really high bluff frequency on the turn.

I'm not trying to be a dick here, and I'm not trying to say you played the hand poorly because we have all done stupid ****. Also, I peel the turn most times but I would know what I was going to do on the river. However, I am saying that yes: you had the NFD OTF but the worst card in the deck hit OTT and when you ch (the right play) you need to determine (at each street) if you can profitably continue in the hand. Also don't show the hand when you are tanking, you don't want people to know you either can't fold or can fold the nut flush in a spot like that.

I think I can profitably play a river with the odds given versus general player types, but until you have more experience and are more comfortable in spots like this then nitting it up in a lot of situations isn't bad.

Playing poker when really deep and OOP can be very hard.

You're right 11t and btw thank you for your feedback. I have always appreciated your posts/threads.

I didn't have any real reads on him. But I did see his black chips and so I assumed he had come from the table games and was therefore aggro. As a result I didn't really give his turn bet that much credit. That is why I called on the turn. I'm not just saying to myself "o geez, NFD. can't fold ever."

As for my plan, my plan was to check and call ace and queen rivers some of the time depending on bet sizing. And to bet out flushes.

Thinking back, my plan on the river was stupid. I think I should have checked and let him bet his entire range. Maybe I could even minraise and get lower flushes to call. I don't know.

B/f river is a good move.

So now fold.

Its not simple, but it is the right move. Sucks, but that's the situation.

if he had JT and the river's the 2d, you should absolutely bet. He might check behind.

Results already! I think the table-game factor makes this a call.

Yeah the river is a clear bet but I'd bet like 350

I think the insta-shove being perceived as weak because he has to think how much he wants to extract with his full house is not a reliable read, at least from my experience.

does Villain look like money is not important to him? If there is some reason to believe this and you are ok with loosing $900 in this spot, I might be leaning to calling.

My gut says call. This is why I don't chase draws OOP on paired boards.

villain has to be a complete and total donk to raise with less. Furthermore, you having the Q and A makes a lot of flushes unlikely.

Pretty much no 1/2 player is capable of doing this as a bluff, and the line is a consistent with a full house

his line makes no sense imho. why would he just flat the flop on a wet board with two pair or sets? i was betting into four other people on the flop, he must have thought i had something pretty good.