Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-18-2019, 05:17 AM   #1
Pechorin
centurion
 
Pechorin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 114
is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I remember reading about the concept of a blocking bet about 10 years ago, in a tournament context. Is this still considered a good idea, or just a half-assed way of owning yourself?

1/2 home game. Villain is loose passive, with laggish tendencies, VPIP/PFR of about 70/20. I am perceived as TAG. Hero has $440, Villain covers.

5 limpers, (UTG+1, MP, LJ, CO, BU) I make it $20 from the SB with JJ, folds around to villain in CO, who calls.

Flop ($43) 1069 I bet $35, villain calls

Turn ($113) 8 I check. Though I now have OESD with overpair, somehow I am leery of this board. Hits villain's range hard and I don't want to be raised off my equity. Villain bets $80, I call.

River ($273) 3 I have $300 left. I don't want to have to check-call a big bet. check folding seems weak. Is this a spot for a blocking bet, say around $100?
Pechorin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 08:39 AM   #2
Spanishmoon
adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Northeast
Posts: 1,044
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I wouldn’t. V has 87/98/76/t9/etc - just so many combos that beat you here and that doesn’t even include one-gappers. The flush didn’t come in so you may still be good, but I doubt it. Save your money.
Spanishmoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 11:43 AM   #3
matzah_ball
veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,556
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

Definitely checking
matzah_ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 11:50 AM   #4
XtraScratch8
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 2,861
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I honestly think blocker bets are not even worth considering implementing in your game. The times that they can be useful are so incredibly rare that it’s really not even worth thinking about. There are dozens and dozens of other concepts that will improve a players game more than blocker bets.
XtraScratch8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 01:09 PM   #5
aisrael01
grinder
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 415
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I can see a reason for making a small river bet if you think Villain will possibly call the bet with worse hands than yours that would otherwise check back the river. But that's not really a blocking bet, it's just a thin value bet. But you would need to be good more than 50% of the time that he calls, and I don't see what part of his range you think you're beating here.

I don't like the idea of betting with the intention to stop your opponent from bluffing. If you think your opponent is overbluffing the river you should check/call with all of your bluffcatchers (JJ-AA and Tx). If you think your opponent is underbluffing then just check/fold all your range.

What bluffs can your opponent even have here? Every conceivable hand he called on the flop has picked up at least a pair on the turn. He would have had to float flop with air, which seems unlikely. You said he's loose passive and then in the same sentence you say he has LAG tendencies. You seem confused on your reads. FWIW I don't think most 1/3 players would try to run an airball bluff on this river, so check/fold is probably best.

Last edited by aisrael01; 05-18-2019 at 01:24 PM.
aisrael01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 01:57 PM   #6
Gorgalosk
grinder
 
Gorgalosk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: 3rd island, Plane of Sky
Posts: 450
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

Does anyone think this is a good opportunity to check and balance out our OOP flop checking range? against this player x/c flop, x/r turn seems pretty viable. Thoughts?
Gorgalosk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 04:12 PM   #7
onlyproud
journeyman
 
onlyproud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: ohio
Posts: 215
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

Quote:
Originally Posted by XtraScratch8 View Post
I honestly think blocker bets are not even worth considering implementing in your game. The times that they can be useful are so incredibly rare that itís really not even worth thinking about. There are dozens and dozens of other concepts that will improve a players game more than blocker bets.
i agree for the most part, but in low stake cash games it is surprisingly useful in my experience, but sizing is something need to be paid great attention to depending on villain tedancies. I see it working lots of the time but see people including myself misusing it and giving hand strength away.
onlyproud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 05:13 PM   #8
krilleater
grinder
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 666
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I'm checking river. Ideally we get to showdown for free. Probably folding if he bets.

OTT, not a big fan of our passive x/call. I'd rather bet myself. Against a thinking player, I would consider x/shoving. We have 2 blockers to the nuts and he's going to have a very hard time calling without a 7 (and thinking players will fold some straights here). Force him to fold any 2-pair.
krilleater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 08:46 PM   #9
XtraScratch8
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 2,861
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

I’ll try to explain this concisely: it is extremely rare that you will make a blocking bet that either A)gets called by worse or b)folds out a better hand, which is the two reasons why we bet...a) for value and b) for bluffs and to fold out better hands.

Even worse, if you’re against a perceptive player, your blocker bets will be met with strong aggression (often with worse holdings than your own) and you will end up surrendering more $ than you would have if you just check/folded. Often you will induce bluffs that you cannot call.

Generally check/call or check/fold or bet/fold are much better, but don’t bet/fold with your bet intending to “block” a better hand. All that betting $100 does in your example is give your opponent $100 for an easy call with most of his holdings.

I could elaborate on this a lot more and might in the next couple days, I’m busy atm. But generally I don’t think blocker bets work well at all.
XtraScratch8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2019, 09:06 PM   #10
pokerforjoker
adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 825
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

you dont beat so much here, unless he floated the flop

i think check folding is fine here, even against a lag
pokerforjoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2019, 09:47 AM   #11
venice10
Referee
 
venice10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nowhere special
Posts: 24,456
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

Blocking bets have a role particularly at low stakes. Many players don't have any real sense of the size of the big in relation to the pot. A $100 bet can look look "big" to many players since they don't have a clue as to how big the pot is. They aren't going to raise without a monster so you can easily fold if that happens. At the same time, they may decided to bet bigger with their TP to get you to fold your overcards (logic isn't of importance to these players, showing you they have a pair of big ones is).
venice10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2019, 10:09 AM   #12
blue moon
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 253
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

against a loose passive you could use a 50$ blocking bet and your never going to get exploited. hes not gonna raise that unless he has a straight all sets n 2 pair will just call.
blue moon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2019, 12:40 PM   #13
aisrael01
grinder
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 415
Re: is a blocking bet ok here - is it ever ok?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue moon View Post
against a loose passive you could use a 50$ blocking bet and your never going to get exploited. hes not gonna raise that unless he has a straight all sets n 2 pair will just call.
A loose passive player isn't betting the turn for 2/3 pot with a hand worse than JJ, so why would we want to put more money into this pot?
aisrael01 is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive