1/2 villain is young Asian American guy. He's raised a few times but he's only recently sat so no sample size. Hasn't shown anything down

~180 effective

He raises in MP to 15, old guy on btn folds and complains that this kid is raising too much very loudly (he isn't). I have AcJx in the sb. Typically I'd 3bet here but the old guys statement stopped me because I thought I might get 4bet light and wouldn't know how to respond. I call

Flop

2c 3c 9

I check he bets 20, I call

Is this light? I feel like he cbets here a ton and if I fold aj I have a very small calling range in this spot (i don't have a whole lot of hands I'm flatting in the sb in general). Plus I have sd value + overs and backdoors

Turn

4c

He bets 40, I call

Once he barrels turn here I feel like he's has over pairs, flushes and KcX air and 56s. The problem is I have the Ac so I'm blocking a lot of his semi bluffs. So I don't really wanna raise here

River 10c

I shove ~$105-- this is an awkward spot, where I just think he checks back so much that I can't check so I just shove.

I think this hand just plays out so much cleaner if I 3bet pre.

We're OOP so I'm inclined to play the turn draw more aggressively because we have fewer implied odds if we hit (and there's 4 to a flush on the board). The 3rd club on the turn may provide us with some fold equity.

Should we just lead into him when we pick up the backdoor NFD on the turn?

We have the Ac which reduces the number of flush draws in V's range. Our hand is only a 1-card draw but the V doesn't know that... a FD can be a large part of our range when we call on a low two-tone flop like this. If we did make our flush on the turn, we wouldn't want the turn to check through where another club kills our action on the river.

If V raises our turn bet, we shove over the top and put him to a hard decision with an overpair (esp. if he doesn't hold a club). If we get called, we still have outs to the nuts.

In general I don't have a leading turn range here... I don't really wanna lead flushes as I'd like to check raise semi bluffs and if I'm leading flushes my c/r range has too many bluffs relative to value hands. Although that may be more reason to ship this turn...

Also if I bet and get raised it's likely a shove (or enough to commit vill) so I'm in the tough spot not villain

NVM leading the flop, stacks are not deep enough for us to have any kind of fold equity on a 3bet. Maybe we're better off check-jamming the turn or just plain open shoving it. $40 is a huge committing bet to call when we might only have 20% equity.

In fact, $20 on the flop is a pretty big bet to call with only $180 starting stacks. We'll have gotten 20% of our stack in with only 2 overs (one of which might be no good) and a backdoor FD.

This hand plays much easier if we just fold pre like we should have. Then fold flop, prolly fold turn. River shove is fine I guess.

I can maybe see folding > calling, but I think 3betting>folding>= calling

I understand why you'd want to fold flop, but I typically don't like to let my opponent cbet ~100% of his range profitabiy so I need to be convinced on folding flop.

I'm willing to be convinced btw but your (beers) comment isn't providing any substance

I mean it's pretty standard IMO. AJo is not a good hand to call OOP. Raising from MP is reasonably strong and LLSNL villains call 3bets too much. So vs. general population, it's an easy fold.

Flop, I don't give a flying banana if villain can theoretically cbet 100% profitably, I'm not balancing vs. monkeys. Without reads I fold air 100% OOP and call or raise when I have a hand. If they're the type to cbet 100%, they are not going to profit by doing so because they're going to make horrible mistakes later in the hand e.g. paying me off light.

EDIT

I mean, what's your plan here? You got a miracle runout and even then you're not sure how to extract. I'd love to see some basis for this to be a remotely profitable line instead of plain spew.

OK then, try this. Give V a range and see how your AJo plays. That's where the substance is. According to you, V hasn't gotten out of line in the short time you've played, so there's very little reason to expect you're not behind until the river. And if he did call your shove, I expect it's only because he had ~Kxss and didn't figure you to hold onto a naked A until you got bailed out.

Ok I ran the numbers putting in what I think his preflop range is in this spot. Assuming he cbets here 100% of the time, it says my hand is ~45% on this flop...our opinion on ranges here may differ obviously

Fold pre for me close to 100℅. Lol @ the speech play.

As played hand is fine but if im vilain im folding anything but K high flush here you played it like you had the nuts on the turn.

So what range did you give him? And why are you assuming he's CB 100% of that?

ETA: I assume, given the title of this thread, that you're looking for justification for your play, but you're not finding it. I've done it before, too. But you're not providing any information on why calling pre, then c/c'ing your way into the nuts, was a good idea. How can you expect to convince anyone, or expect anyone to convince you, when you're not giving the information for an informed argument?

Fold pre, AINEC.

Need some reads on Vil before 3betting this here.


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Not trying to justify . Agree calling isn't great , but I had a reason for not 3betting, I guess just folding was better

I'm really more trying to figure out what hands I can call with on that flop that I call with pre (I think live players in general cbet ridiculously high, especially considering they check a lot when they hit hard meaning their cbet range is actually pretty weak)

And whether the turn is a shove/call/fold I think all 3 are probably fine in the moment it's hard to fold a combo draw w overs though

TT+ looks pretty good when this shallow on this flop


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I'm not calling pre w TT+

Then you should have 0 preflop call range in this spot. 3 or fold.


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I prob call ajs, aqs, kqs, Aqo maybe a10s and pocket pairs. Again I typically don't call w Ajo here. I guess I just should call flop w pocket pairs and flush draws and fold the rest

And I'm telling you to not call at all, this shallow.

Start w 99+/AK and add in some down the line as suits your taste, but all of them should be 3bet.


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