UTG: limps
UTG +1: limps
UTG + 3 (Hero): over limps with 33
LJ (V1): limps
HJ (V2): limps
Blinds complete

Flop:
3h 4d Ah

Checks to hero who bets 10
V1 calls
V2 raises to 30
Hero calls
V1 calls

Turn:
Ad

Checks to V2 who bets 50
Hero and V1 call

River: Qd
Checks to V2 who bets 100
Hero??

If we think V2 is incapable of bluffing can we fold? I don't think Villain raises flush draw on the flop because he has been playing too nitty, and I don't think he over limps 25, from a theory stand point I know I can never fold, but it feels super gross to call when V2 has 44 A4 or A3 as most of the hands in his range.

I can't even contemplate folding here. In fact, depending on stack sizes I'm contemplating a raise.

V2 is making under 1/2 pot bet on turn and less on river. Even if youre sure he's value betting - why would you give him a FH? I could easily imagine AT/AJ - in fact - any suited ace.

Mention stack sizes next post.

call but not stoked

If V2 is incapable of bluffing that means he's also incapable of value betting AK on the river I assume? And if so, then you should be lead/folding the river to get value from Ax hands that check back river and also from flushes.

If you really want to find a fold, you'd have to fold the turn as there's no reason to call turn and fold river if his range is 44/A4/A3. It depends if he ever has AK-AJ type hands.

+1 I'm probably x/r the turn to setup a psb on the river. Of course this depends on stack sizes.

AP, never folding here. If you're really concerned just call, but I don't mind a x/r on this river.

People don't typically raise one pair hands OTF, at least not in the games I play in. And he's probably betting small on turn and river because he has a boat and doesn't want to lose customers (not saying that's good, but people do it).

I'm calling down because the hand is just too strong, but I'd rather fold than raise.

I don't actually get what you guys who want to raise are putting him on. In your games, are people both passive enough to limp big aces in position behind limpers and yet aggressive enough to raise two players vs nearly a PSB OTF with one pair?

I see players limp AK all the time especially at 1-2. OP provided no reads so it's a (small) part of players' ranges. I x/r turn and shove river. As played I would probably x/r river. Never folding. Not at 1-2.

Not necessarily advocating a raise OTR.... but definitely thinking it through.

And yes, I can certainly imagine players limping AT/AJ and then raising that flop in position. In game, I'd probably also be considering the small raise could indicate a FD or a 'see where I'm at' kind of bet. When the second A hits the turn and he continues... hes just supporting the story. By the river - I guess you have to acknowledge he could have 44 - but I'm still leaving an A in his range and calling.

I guess I just can't automatically give a player 2p+ on a flop raise.

Villain is not overplaying Ax on flop.

Raise pre

That can't be right. Folding is closer to right than raising two limpers from UTG+3 with 33.

Even nitty villains raise AJ or something on this flop to protect against a flush. Are you are you aren't being results oriented here?

I am never folding here at 1/2, people can think any A and maybe flush is the nuts.

You can lose sometimes, but I think run this spot 100 times and a call is profitable.

Lol at folding. Depending on stack sizes, which you didn't post, I'm snap calling or shoving.

Edit: If you are super deep, which is really rare at 1/2, then you could also raise/fold.

Of the subset of players who do not raise AJ preflop, only a small minority would raise AJ on this flop.

As commented above, villain is not raising Ax on the flop, and villain is not raising a backdoor flush draw. Obviously this is player specific, but if villain is only raising A4, A3, and 44 on flop, and is not raising flush draws then villain has an empty bluffing range, and is only betting 44+ and I think I can fold turn.

If you're so sure of this then why is this a thread?? You have limited V to AA/44/A4/A3, all which are beating you OTT. If you're so sure with your read, then fold turn. If not, then lol at folding this @ 1/2, because imo, even nitty opponents will have some slush fund of "wtf were they thinking" in their play

Also, since I think this is a reverse HH since you're so sure of Vs play, river bet sizing is terrible. Draws bricked out, no one is calling who misssd. Players with Ax are calling a lot as are all under boats, I probably shove this river

The BDFD came in. So not ALL draws.

You have listed no reads on any of the players, so I don't know why we are assuming villain is incapable of bluffing, or why he will never raise with high ace hands. I see people raise all the time with TPTK otf, and the only reason I have to doubt this is that op is leaking into the thread about what V showed up with.

If you got set-over-set with somebody with 4s, that's rough and a cooler. Even rougher with queens. I would call the first bet, but fold if V1 comes over the top. And if you did fold, please for the love of God don't show.

I could also see the argument for raise here, but my worry would be with the bdfd coming in, you are never being called by better. V2 never has a flush here (V1 might, but does he think he's good with two people in front of him loving life?

Fair enough, but I'd argue there are probably more combos of FHs than of flushes that get there, based on action and turn/river. So if we were V and had like AQ/A4/AA, id be bombing this river



Given V raises a flop with an A and barreled an A turn, its highly unlikely V arrives at the river with QQ. That's some next level **** if V does

I agree. I was implying it shouldn't and if it did, it's a cooler.

Still calling here, just so people don't think I am as nitty as GG. Folding though to a V1 re-raise though.

I am calling here. So many hands V could think are good. Not thrilled still having V1 in the hand, but can't fold (unless V1 re-pops it).

Why did you flat flop? (I'll read other replies now, so ignore question if you answered.)

Results?

Calling and not thinking about it much. NEVER raising in this spot though.