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AQo from BB in Straddled Pot

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02-23-2018 , 10:26 AM

YoungGrimmm

enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 52

New table and a few orbits in at 1-3 NLHE. 1 large stack of around 450 and everyone else is between 200 and 300 in their stacks. Everyone seems pretty standard 1-2 or 1-3 calibre. Pick up AQo in the BB and there is $6 straddle. 5 callers, including the big stack then the button makes it $41. SB folds. What do we do here with our stack of $275? I've had this discussion with a friend and his response was:

Either make it $120 if you think the button was just stealing all the straddles or fold.

This situation is one I struggle with everytime there is a straddle.

Thoughts?

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02-23-2018 , 10:33 AM

mdelore

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 1,315

Quote:

Either make it $120 if you think the button was just stealing all the straddles or fold.

I agree with your friend, probably should do a mix of 3b and fold. How you want to assign percentages is up to you.

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02-23-2018 , 10:37 AM

Playbig2000

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 11,349

Any reads on the button? It would depend on his range. I'm hardly ever calling there, I would raise or fold but raising will commit us basically on the flop.

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02-23-2018 , 10:47 AM

Javanewt

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 12,781

Re-read OP and realize he has no/little info on BTN. Can you at least give a description?

At a new table full of average players and <100bb, I probably just raise this.

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02-23-2018 , 10:59 AM

YoungGrimmm

enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 52

Button has limped a couple hands and played a flop or two but nothing else to really go on. No showdowns. He C-bet about half pot once and won and then folded the other hands.

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02-23-2018 , 11:01 AM

Javanewt

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 12,781

Is he old, young, wearing hoodie, business attire, sweatshirt, etc.? What vibe do you get from him?

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02-23-2018 , 11:01 AM

Eholeing

adept

Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 777

Jam Unless you think he only does this with ak/aa/kk/qq, fold if that's his range. Calling is not good, same as 3betting small.

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02-23-2018 , 11:05 AM

Joey913

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 1,300

I would fold or jam, with a preference toward jamming as I type this behind my computer screen. At the table, I probably talk myself into a fold but in all honesty it is probably just a variance avoidance thing.

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02-23-2018 , 11:42 AM

Playbig2000

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 11,349

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungGrimmm

Button has limped a couple hands and played a flop or two but nothing else to really go on. No showdowns. He C-bet about half pot once and won and then folded the other hands.

he sounds passive enough for me to snap fold. We're basically deciding here to get all of our money in or not on this hand.

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02-23-2018 , 12:05 PM

#10

mdelore

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 1,315

Jamming lets button fold worse hands and call with better.

Raise to $120 is more likely to keep in the AJ, AT, that will be dominated, and also the 99, TT hands that will fold to a K or J high flop shove.

FWIW if I raise to $120 I'm shoving a ton of flops.

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02-23-2018 , 12:35 PM

#11

cheesefist

journeyman

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 376

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playbig2000

he sounds passive enough for me to snap fold. We're basically deciding here to get all of our money in or not on this hand.

Against most players and 100% of action players this is a standard raise.

Against very quiet passive players or nits, it's a fold.
Description of V is thin, but it does sound like a fold in this case. I need to feel pretty good that he can do this with 88+/ATo hands or worse.

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02-23-2018 , 12:59 PM

#12

gobbledygeek

Poet Laureate of LLSNL

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 36,150

Yeah, either 3bet to commit / shove any flop (perhaps slowplaying A high flops) or fold. Can't call off a huge percentage of our stack preflop OOP just hoping to hit TP on the flop.

I'd typically fold as I don't believe AQo fares that well against the majority of most peoples raising ranges plus there isn't a lot of other dead money in the pot (i.e. if someone hadda raised earlier and had 5 calls then much more reason to risk our stack). Obviously dependent on what image we apply to Button, but in general I need to see reasons to commit here if I'm not going with a default fold.

GcluelessNLnoobG

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02-23-2018 , 01:18 PM

#13

YoungGrimmm

enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 52

Does the presence of other players who had called the straddle come into your thinking at all?

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02-23-2018 , 01:34 PM

#14

Javanewt

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 12,781

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungGrimmm

Does the presence of other players who had called the straddle come into your thinking at all?

Not if they are average 1/2 and 1/3 players. They shouldn't be expecting the BTN to raise anymore than you should -- they have the same info -- so hard to think they are limp/raising here.

Does the straddler look like a gambly type? Has anyone else straddled?

Honestly, though, if you don't have a feel yet for the table and you don't want to "gamble," just fold and wait until you know more.

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02-23-2018 , 01:39 PM

#15

Irunsobad

centurion

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 110

I think more information is required in this situation. First of all what is the stack of the button? Also, what are the remaining players likely to do. If the callers are likely to fold to this squeeze, I think AQo is too strong to fold to this raise, as villain could be doing this a ton of worse hands. If the callers are likely to call behind if you flat (most likely situation), I like your friends 3 betting strategy is correct.

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02-23-2018 , 02:43 PM

#16

YoungGrimmm

enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 52

There have been a few straddles but not crazy like every hand.
The button had around $250 or so, basically the same as I did. He was a mid 30s looking guy. Jeans and golf shirt kinda thing. As far as reads I really didn't have anything yet. No one seemed to be playing every hand or getting out of line so maybe that's part of the reason I was posting. I just didn't know what to think with those guys behind me to act.

Last edited by YoungGrimmm; 02-23-2018 at 02:44 PM. Reason: spelling

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02-23-2018 , 03:02 PM

#17

sactownjoey

adept

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 853

I think your friend was right. OOP, you don't close action, committing 1/2 your stack on a hand that is likely flipping/way behind an unknown where you don't have any reason yet to believe the aggression is thin.

I like to think I would fold.

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02-23-2018 , 04:06 PM

#18

setintostraight

adept

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 884

This is a jam or fold spot, because a good sized 3! makes us commit half of our stack and we absolutely hate our life if we get snapped on (likely AKs+, so we're a huge dog) or whiff flop, since we don't have any fold equity with a <1/2 PSB behind.

Against an unknown, I'm about 80/20 on fold/jam percentages. Maybe too nitty but whatever.

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02-23-2018 , 04:24 PM

#19

adam levine

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,569

The deceptive part about this spot is that you will be making most of your money from when it folds around,as you’re not doing well vs a get it in range,opponent dependent of course but I 3! Ship like 35-40 percent and fold the rest,how you chop it up is up to you.

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02-23-2018 , 04:56 PM

#20

PFunkaliscious

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 3,061

definately an interesting spot.

only four hands we are worried about are QQ, KK, AA, and AK.

On a new table, the overaggressive play is usually given the benefit of the doubt until someone is caught bluffing or the table loosens up a bit, so the standard play would be to fold.

But, if you pick up on something from the button that is out of line, I would definately make it 120.

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