Pre note:I made ranges for all positions tonight and decided to make a small adjusment during the play when i noticed this guy. VERYL LOOSE PASSIVE FISH.
I'm playing live NL $0.5/1 (rather estimates since NOK currency is fked up, in NOK it's 5/10 NOK) full ring, and i have been observing that he check calls all the way down to just fold with small pairs and donk bet-fold just spew basically. He once had the nuts and he check called flop- check raised turn- bet river and won a nice pot.

I'm in the cutoff right before the button and villain who is UTG1 limped, MP1 limps, LP folds to me and i look down at

A4

I go ahead and raise to about $8 with $100 total starting stack(100bb). SB calls (major fish check folds almost every flop, unless he hits), Bb folds and villain in UTG+1 calls.

Flop: A8Q

Villain in UTG+1 checks and we decide to bet 75% $18 into the pot leaving behind $74 (not sure if the big bet here is a mistake?)

SB folds. Heads up UTG+1 calls $18.

Turn: A

Villain checks.
Hero bets $24 - 50$ behind.

Villain waits and flat calls.

River: 3

Villain checks? Does this cap his range to alot of missed gutters/Qx- 66-77-99's?

HERO makes a thin value of $20 because he don't get called too often by worse hands other then Qx, some pockets which i thought was better then a shove based on villain calling with alot of second hands.

VILLAIN SHOVES and puts us in for rest.

Getting 4:1 to call here are we ever good here vs this kind of villain, maybe he rivered 3's full?

Hero calls

Villain shows 88

Is this guy a fish or did we just get outplayed?

Thanks for the input.

I think checking flop is better to get value from worse hands on later streets. Fold to X/R on river if you like money. People don't X/R bluff OTR at LLSNL enough to warrant a call here that is almost certainly a slowplayed boat or trips w/ a better kicker.

Note: results of hand aren't needed

Very true, i knew right after the hand that my bet OTF might have been the mistake in this hand, maybe better off taking a line such as check-call OTF, check-call turn and re-evaluate river, given the way Villain had played earlier nuts in a different way and calling down alot of seconds/middles affected my play here.

fold pre, maybe limp behind.

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No thanks jeff , in 0.5/1 game in the cutoff with two fishes?

edit: not everyone is so nitty you know brb poker is still not dead 2k16 people flat PF with J7o

*grunch*

it's going to be extremely rare that you can get 3 streets of value with no kicker on this board. if you're going to get stacked on an A hi board drawing basically dead with this hand, then you should not be raising it 8x PF, period.

I like checking flop most, though I also don't mind c-betting here and pot-controlling turn. on this runout, you should absolutely be checking behind turn if you bet flop.

seems like you're looking at the absolute value of your hand (trip aces woot) and missing that you're not going to get a lot of value here, since what you really have is much closer to KK than AK in terms of relative value.

tl;dr three barrels on this board with A4 is suicide.

You were outplayed on every street IMO.

Raise pre is dabateable, but I suspect if you play fine post flop you will show a profit, so it's fine.
Flop needs to be a smaller bet or a check as we aren't getting value from a lot of hands with that large of a bet. If we bet smaller we get looked up by gut shots, weak second pair type hands and random middle pocket pair floats. With this bet sizing, we are
a) trying to play for stacks with a hand that we shouldn't try to play for stacks with
b) helping them to play perfectly against us

On the river, when a fish shoves into us, we're never good here. Ever.
Period.

Just fold.

you were beat pretty bad here, I think you might be underestimating their skill level or overestimating yours. "two fishes" just cleaned you out..

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Please don't assume things, the max BI is 250bb, my first 100bb BI was to test the table and adjust plan was to add anyways so i reloaded 250bb and ended up busting 3 players and the guy that won 100b later that night for his 550BB stack, i was just posting this hand for feedback as i made a mistake somewhere.

Don't post the results in the OP, as it skews the responses.
Wait at least 24 hours for everyone around the globe to get a chance to see the post & respond.

AP, you need to shove river.

ya - ok champ. This hand is played terribly

+1 to phil ivey 'testing the tables' here. lol.

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I like checking somewhere also, but I don't mind your line too much except for not folding to the shove. You're not beating anything that he would be shoving.

Also, you don't have to test low stakes tables by spewing a buy-in. Hey are almost universally filled with passive fish that you recognize in one orbit of folding. They also rarely adjust so if you fold for 3 hours and then raise, you still get paid by worse kickers and people calling bets with bottom pair.

Grunch:

Pre: I'm not raising pre, let's just see a cheap flop with huge implied odds. Fat value betting only occurs when we flop 2 pairs or better.

Flop: I check here, no way do I start building a big pot with this hand. I want to take fish to value town, not drive myself there.

Turn: AP I check because I'm not sure what's worse that's still calling, obviously if I checked flop like I wanted to, I'm betting now.

River: Making yourself pot committed screws up thin betting. You need to make a bet that you can fold when you figure you'll only get raised by better. So you should check here. You should also check because villain shouldn't really have worse by now.

Also, don't post the same hand in two forums in the future.

Locked.