I have been fairly active with a few 3 bets and have been sitting for about 2 hours.

Villian 1 is a middle aged solid reg

villian 2 is a loose passive player

we are 100bb effective

I am dealt AKss in the bb. Villian makes it 15 to and and villian 2 calls, I decide not to 3 bet and just see a flop. I would say that I would 3 bet 75% of the time here but I had been actively 3 betting and didnt want to get into a bloated pot oop and like that my hand will be disguised if I do hit flop.

Flop Ac 10s 4c

I check, V1 bets 35 and v2 calls

I make it 135 and and V1 shoves for roughly $380 on top of the 135 and V2 folds

What do you think about the my check raise? And now is this just an easy fold here? I typically dont like to fold when I started out to set a trap but this spot was tricky. Ive broken this hand down a lot since but I would like opinions. Thanks

Pre is meh, I like the 3! But it's not mandatory, this hand does play easier if you 3! Though.

Donk the flop Imo, ak is pretty disguised here, it's going to look like we have a weak ace and hopefully we will get a couple of streets from aj/aq here....you will probably get a call from kk-jj as well for the first bet.

Check is fine. I sort of don't mind the check raise here, c/r one pair hands is usually a disaster but I don't mind it in this scenario.

I think now V2 shoves though you have to call this off unfortunately, feel like he is going to show us a set of tens or at, pretty often, but you have to figure aq/aj are in there and a bunch of flush draws I would guess....
Villans so have a tendency to spaz when they get check raised and have tp on the flop also. Because they just think c/r = flush draw so I think call it off.

Flatting pre is spew

My plan was to check raise the flop and if they both called and turn was a brickish card to jam 400 into about 450. If only V1 calls then I would feel pretty confident that his range includes 16 combos of aq and aj that I have crushed and can get value from, 6 combos of ak and only 3 combos of sd/fd that im 50/50 with. V2 was very loose and I wouldnt be surprised if he had a low fd, gutshot, j10, pretty open range with him. Some table talk from before entered my mind when V1 shoved though. I remember the day before someone was talking about raising the river with an overpair and he said that raising a river with a 1 pair hand would be horrible. I know raising a river and raising a flop is different but... I think when he jams over our c/r the worst hand he has is an AK here. Also like I said I am normally going to go ahead and 3 bet this but I didnt want to bloat the pot oop when I was pretty confident that they would both call. thanks for the responses

Yeah 3 banging this the vast majority of the time, can't be bad to mix in some flats though.

I like a x/c after playing the hand like this pre, x/r seems to sorta be over-repping your hand and this seems a good calling down hand, maybe check/jamming good turns?

AP don't think you can fold for the reasons ronrabbit stated

Be nice to know the villain's position in the hand. World of difference between a UTG+1 and CO raise pf.

I hadn't thought of donk betting this flop as played, but I like it. It keeps our range wider than a x/r and prevents the hand from checking through. The x/r just turns the hand into a bluff.

I would check call on some boards but I feel like if I can take control of the hand right here and get called by aq, aj then I can get max value from these hands. I normally dont like trapping with a hand and then folding but what hands is he jamming over a check raise here that we are doing well against? Remember this guy had been playing solid for hours yesterday and today...

Sorry, villian 1 was in the HJ and and v2 was cut off

I also like the donk bet approach. It would make it look like drawy or maybe like a weaker Ace. I thought about doing that during the hand but elected to go with check raise and jam a lot of turns. I think electing to check raise still keeps my hand a bit disguised because I can def still have a draw here... It also turns his hand a lot more face up. Donk betting would somewhat do that as well but lets say I lead for 50 and he makes it 150, I guess we are donking to go with it at this point. I was very surprised when he shoved here, in my mind I was already ready to see a turn and when he shoved I just couldnt find hands that im doing well against anymore.

C/r isn't bad... But I think you've mostly going to have to call this shove.... Another thing if you're not 3! AKo sometimes, that's fine - but I think AKs should be an auto 3bet pretty much always.

I think AKo is more of a 3 bet because it is slightly tougher to play oop. I a usually 3 betting here though. I had been active and didnt want to be oop vs 2 people in an inflated pot. If there was another caller and I could make a large enough 3 bet then I would have gone for it though. But overall I agree

I disagree that AKo is ever preferable to 3bet over AKs. More equity with AKs, more opportunity to profitably ship the money in, etc. You want to play bigger pots when you have more equity.

That is a good point too. The feeling that I got from the last time I 3 bet was that they were getting annoyed with it tho so I didnt want to get 4 bet and be put into a tough spot or get flatted and be put into a tough spot. i thought if I hit the flop ill get paid off anyway and if I dont then its just a easy fold

You have aks, you want them both to call. Make it $75 pre and it sets up a trivial stack off post. Being oop is irrelevant - the only way you're going to not be oop is by folding. Also ak wants to play a bloated pot, it does well in small Spr situations, not high spr's. It also is perfectly fine to stack off w/ 100bb deep facing a 4bet.

I dont like just taking a standard line every time and I felt comfortable playing a pot with a deeper spr vs these players. I was pretty confident that if I hit a favorable flop that I would still be able to get the money in without having the bloat it pre.

Results at bottom of this post
I rarely will under rep my hand and then fold but I made an in game decision here and decided to let this one go due to a few factors. One was this guy is a solid tight player who made a comment about how raising a river w an over pair would be terrible. I had seen him play very few pots and never saw him getting out of line at all. he also shoved fairly quickly and seemed confident sitting there.

I ended up folding and he was nice enough to show me A10 for top two. felt good to save money due to an in game correct feel spot. Thanks for all the replies

huh?

so this is 2/5?

and V made it 15? just 3BB and you flatted with AKss?

and now we are specifically ranging V on TT or 44?

hmmmm... that is player dependant.

with us massively underreping our preflop hand, V could easily be shoving with AJ+ here and think that he is good.

but, we are also repping TT or 44 and he is still shoving over the top of us.

seems a bit tight, but a fold is ok. not great. even if V has KTcc, KQcc, or some other combo draw, we are slight faves. But if V is shoving with AQ-, and we have him smashed, this would be a terrible fold.

I'm not sure why you came to a strategy forum to discuss taking a suboptimal line

I cam to a strategy forum to discuss a hand. youre stuck on the you should have 3 bet thing, I said I normally would but I didnt this time for the reasons that I stated. I know what the standard play with ak is pre. I am more concerned with hearing opinions of the c/r and whether or not to call the shove. Im not trying to argumentative, I just dont agree that you have to 3 bet AK every time. I am confident in my post flop play that if I want to build the pot i will be able to and if i want to control the pot that I will be able to so im ok with taking a tricky line, even if its not gto.

When villian shoves I think his range is down to AK+ and combo draws. I dont think this specific player would shove a lot of fd because he has been very tight and has made some nitty comments. Also he seemed very confident after he shoved. I feel like the hands that we have smashed are going to flat on that flop tho. If it was online or this guy was a typical younger type player i would make the call.

so you've been very active at this table therefore they will be less respectful of your bets and raises and you pick up a premium hand and decide to just flat preflop?????!?????!???? what????? no no no no no no no no. 3bet here is mandatory calling is not even an option. calling here is 100% a mistake. imo there is no room for discussion on this. good luck coming to that realization.

its like standing on the railroad tracks.

yeah it seems like he wants to prove why flatting a pf raise with AKss after being very active is ever good. you seriously never need to mix up your play with this hand in this spot its just 3bet 100% of the time here. easy.

I'm not trying to prove anything. I just said basically agree to disagree. I dont mind mixing it up because I felt like ill still get paid off when I make a hand and when I dont ill get away cheaper. Its fine if you dont agree with my reasoning. I was more interested in the c/r and fold discussion.

I don't think it's really acceptable to never have AK when you flat this open. I know it's $2/$5 and you shouldn't be trying to be super balanced etc etc but you will be encountering some decent opponents who will pick up on something as clear as that.

Or are you just saying that AKs is always a 3b and AKo you can mix in some flats?

3bet pre
as played, CR and call the shove

This is my way of thinking. I want to keep them in the pot and dont mind playing deeper spr with fairly straight forward opponents pre. Normally I am 3 betting but some of the close mindedness to anything but standard cant be good for growth as a player.