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Old 07-19-2018, 02:00 PM   #1
tuds38
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AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

2/5 NL, 200-1,000 buyin. V1 (MP) has 225 and has been tight-passive, V2 has 500 and is fairly loose, opening a lot of hands and I have 3! him a couple times, once he folded and once he called them x/f flop. Haven't seen many showdowns but V2 once limp-called a raise in LP with 74s. Hero covers, image is a bit loose pre but have been whiffing boards and having to give up a lot.

V1 opens to 25 in MP, V2 reraises to 75 in HJ. Hero ?? with AKo on button.

With V1s stack he is probably pushing or folding. I think having 3-bet V2 a couple times already, he is unlikely to fold any decent pocket pair to a 4-bet. V2 range is probably 99+, AK, maybe AQs. I haven't seen him 3! yet.
V1 should have a similar range.

If I flat it's very possible V1 jams and V2 rips it all in, if I raise I might squeeze the bottom of V1s range out but like I said V2 is likely going for it.

Thoughts appreciated.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:35 PM   #2
shorn7
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Everyone else will probably disagree, but I would flat here and see what V1 does. You have good position for the rest of the hand, but crappy relative right now as V1 will have to react to the 3! after you. Flatting allows you to perhaps fold pre is V1 shoves and V2 5! over the top. And if V1 just flats, your hand is under-repped and you can play accordingly.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:17 PM   #3
c0rnBr34d
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Interesting spot. Looking forward to feedback as well. I'm sure I play these situations too passively because I often think in multi way pots my AK is a drawing hand and is more likely to lose equity because someone else has an Ace or a King and the person in the hand with the pocket pair has increased equity. Does this line of thinking have any merit?
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:22 PM   #4
bigdaddycope
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

180, and obv not folding after putting ~ half our stack in the middle
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:22 PM   #5
HawkesDave
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

I think flatting here is going to open you up to an even wider shove by V1 and iso-shove by V2 so I would never flat here unless you're prepared to possibly call off a 5b iso shove by V2. If you're not ready to call a 5b iso shove then I think I'm only considering flatting QQ+ here since a 4b with those hands will almost certainly fold out V2. I'd probably just 4b here if I'm confident in my read that V2 is loose unless I'm trying to induce a 5b shove by V2 if he's reckless, in which case you can flat and call off whatever comes at you afterwards. I can't find a fold here with the open coming from a tight player who only has 50bbs.
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Old 07-19-2018, 04:42 PM   #6
Chicagodude
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

I would flat in this instance.
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Old 07-19-2018, 04:55 PM   #7
momo_uk
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkesDave View Post
I think flatting here is going to open you up to an even wider shove by V1 and iso-shove by V2 so I would never flat here unless you're prepared to possibly call off a 5b iso shove by V2. If you're not ready to call a 5b iso shove then I think I'm only considering flatting QQ+ here since a 4b with those hands will almost certainly fold out V2. I'd probably just 4b here if I'm confident in my read that V2 is loose unless I'm trying to induce a 5b shove by V2 if he's reckless, in which case you can flat and call off whatever comes at you afterwards. I can't find a fold here with the open coming from a tight player who only has 50bbs.

Are you 4b calling or 4b folding to V2?
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Old 07-19-2018, 05:20 PM   #8
HawkesDave
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by momo_uk View Post
Are you 4b calling or 4b folding to V2?
Gonna be hard to fold.

If you 4b to 180 as someone mentioned earlier, for example: If V1 folds and V2 5b shoves, you're 31% against QQ+ and you're getting 31% pot odds.

If V1 shoves and V2 shoves, I think I could find a fold. You're getting better pot odds but you're more likely to be facing KK+ from at least one of them, and if not you're possibly dealing with card removal consequences.
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Old 07-19-2018, 05:52 PM   #9
zqzeek
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Trying to wrap my head around this one, and I think want more detail on the reads.

(1) V1 is tight-passive: Does this mean you think this MP raising range is ridiculously narrow? If so, fold is fine (I still play in a 1/2 pool, where some people are truly only raising with QQ+, AKs. No shame in folding against such a raise.); if not there's no reason to think he'll get involved if you 4!

(2) V2 is fairly loose, opening a lot of hands. OK. But have you seen him 3bet? What do you think his range is for that? Is V2 aware of V1's tightness or passivity or both? If you think that V2 is 3betting light, then your 4bet can easily be for value.

(3) "V2 is likely going for it." Because he doesn't believe you? Meaning that he'll "go for it" light? Then 4bet / call is a winning play. But this depends on the answer to (2) above.

-EF
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Old 07-19-2018, 06:58 PM   #10
iraisetoomuch
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

4bet to 200 with the plan to call it off

Or

Fold now

Or

Flat with the intention of calling a 5bet ship.

Just don't flat or raise with the intention of folding pre flop.
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Old 07-19-2018, 08:14 PM   #11
Tomark
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Re: AKo facing cold 3-bet on button (2/5)

Jam. Youll pick up a free $107 plenty, if the shorty calls and biggie folds, the dead money will put you in a good spot, if the biggie calls oh well, hopefully youre flipping although youre sort of hoping he just folds QQ/JJ/AK.
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