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Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies.

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Old 04-16-2019, 02:08 PM   #76
Amanaplan
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Re: AK,300BB deep OOP against young aggro 3 bettor

Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek View Post
That's definitely one way of disguising your range. The other method is the opposite: have no raising / reraising range at all when deep (especially OOP). And in keeping with my idea of not building big pots against difficult players, it's pretty obvious the method I would choose.

Gbutthat'smeG
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek View Post
No, the exact same argument applies for AA, imo. If we're deep enough that a 4bet won't set up trivial stack off situations and still leaves a bunch of stacks / streets behind, then there's no way I'm going to 4bet just cuz "I haz AA" and turn my hand face up deep.

GbutotherscandowhattheywantG
OP sorry to hijack, but GG, you are flat wrong on this as a stratagem for deep. I'll leave it at that.
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:11 PM   #77
johnnyBuz
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Re: AK,300BB deep OOP against young aggro 3 bettor

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Originally Posted by 3xMassGainer View Post
can we continue exploring

Like Clicking it back to $160

Or does this work with a bigger stack and yes I’ll be 4b clickbacking with my entire range so I don’t turn my cards face up forcing villain to play perfectly
I've seen some smaller 3b/4b/5b sizings lately but this particular one just felt like clicking buttons.

2/5 with $1000-1500 effective stacks

Loose PFR opened $15 in EP
MP calls $15
LP calls $15
SB 3b $65 (previously observed him 3b small from blinds with K3s)
PFR 4b $135
SB 5b $310
PFR calls $310

Flop ($650) Axxhh
SB bets 125/650
PFR calls 125/650
Turn pairs board x/x
River brick SB leads 2/3 PSB PFR folds SB shows AA

Last edited by johnnyBuz; 04-16-2019 at 02:36 PM.
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:24 PM   #78
Petrucci
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Re: AK,300BB deep OOP against young aggro 3 bettor

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Originally Posted by Amanaplan View Post
OP sorry to hijack, but GG, you are flat wrong on this as a stratagem for deep. I'll leave it at that.
No problem. Ive been on this forum long enough to know what GG is up to, and i disagree with him on alot of stuff.

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Old 04-16-2019, 02:48 PM   #79
Amanaplan
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Re: AK,300BB deep OOP against young aggro 3 bettor

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Originally Posted by 3xMassGainer View Post
Is this thread done or can we continue exploring

Like

Clicking it back to $160

Or does this work with a bigger stack and yes I’ll be 4b clickbacking with my entire range so I don’t turn my cards face up forcing villain to play perfectly

Does anyone want to entertain discuss this or is this thread complete
The only reason you would choose a smaller size would be if you had established some sort of 4b bluffing range, which, has not happened and rarely is the case in a live setting. If you have a more traditional '1/3 4b range', it's mostly going to be high-frequency KK+ w some AQ+ occupying the worst of it in which case you want to bet more for reasons that should now be obvious, but I will try to elaborate further...

When it comes to sizing 3b+ ranges in 1/3 and 2/5, it really is about what you have established to that point because 3 and 4 bet pots are more rare in these games.

Think about it this way, say you know that some player will cold 4b w AA only, but cold call a 3b with ~TT+/AQs+. For this player, when stacks are shallow, he can elect to 4b AA at whatever size he chooses, and you rarely, likely never, have a +EV call because implied odds are not worth it with fractional stacks in play. Now, as stacks deepen, say toward infinity, this same player would have to start choosing larger and larger sizing if he elected to 4b AA only because implieds sky-rocket as does the possibility that AA will be forced to choose 0EV (fold) at some point later in the hand. If stacks were infinite, and AA was his only 4b, he would be forced to choose the largest sizing possible and his opponent would be forced to fold all but the other AA combo.

So, when deep and deeper, this player is going to 'benefit' from moving AA into that cold calling a 3b range because he has not established any 4b range other than AA. As we know, clearly there is no benefit at all to making less money immediately with the nuts and choosing a strategy so poor that your only option is to make less money with your most profitable hand.

Back to your question, you are not AA only, so you can 4bet, and choose a sizing when 300bb deep that is NOT all-in. However, you are still narrow so you slide the sizing scale appropriately.
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:52 PM   #80
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Re: AK,300BB deep OOP against young aggro 3 bettor

Thank you, I learned today
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