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AA vs 4 opponents AA vs 4 opponents

07-14-2018 , 02:49 AM
$1-$2 NL Cash Game

Three players limp.
Hero is on the Button with AA and raises to $15
SB calls - UTG calls - MP calls - CO calls

5 players
Pot = $78

Flop: KJ5
Four checks - Hero bets $50 - SB calls - CO calls
3 players
Pot = $228

Turn: T
SB bets $35 - CO calls - Hero calls
3 players
Pot = $333

River: T
SB checks - CO checks - Hero ???

Should I be happy to check behind this river?
Or is there any value to be gained by a bet?
Please advise.

Remaining stacks:
SB = $243
MP = $155

Players:
Hero = I should be viewed as Loose-Aggressive.
I have been seen opening with trash, but only when it has shown down as the winner.

SB = Loose-Passive
He plays a lot of hands and rarely bets them himself.
We had a recent hand that went like this:
He check-called my flop overbet on a board of JT9 with JT
On a turn of 8, he then led out small
And on a river of K, he led out small

MP = Loose-Passive
He plays a lot of hands and likes to chase quietly.
We had a recent hand that went like this:
I opened from the Button, and he called from the SB with AA
He then check-called my pot sized bets the entire way on a board of K62K7



--CM
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-14-2018 , 04:47 AM
yeah just check behind, he's trying to induce action or "betting for info" to see how you react. He probably has a single pair with flush draw or something, dont think he calls more.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-14-2018 , 08:23 AM
More pre-flop. This probably isn't the first raise at the table that's gone 5 ways to the flop. Especially if you have a LAG image. If people are going to assign a loose range to you, and call light.....MAKE THEM PAY!! Minimum $20 pre-flop. More if you can....and it sounds like you can.

On river....this is a textbook spot for thin value. The only person in the hand who's shown any aggression is the SB, and it's pretty lukewarm aggression. I just don't see him having a flush or a set with his chosen line. And the CO's range seems even worse (probably just the Ah).

You've counterfeited KJ and K5, and as far as I can tell, that's the top of their range here. Definitely bet.

You can get called some of the time by Kings, or KJ. Looks like they'll fold most of the time. And winning the pot without showdown is not a value-less result.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-14-2018 , 12:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingOwl

On river....this is a textbook spot for thin value.
Sounds good.
Pot is $333.
How much should we bet?

--cm
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-14-2018 , 12:49 PM
all of it
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-14-2018 , 10:31 PM
I rather xb flop TBH and then bet turn if another heart doesn't roll off.

River is a great card for us, hard to see what's out there that beats us.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-15-2018 , 03:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
I rather xb flop TBH and then bet turn if another heart doesn't roll off.

River is a great card for us, hard to see what's out there that beats us.
So if we jam and he calls what does he have?
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-15-2018 , 05:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by javi
So if we jam and he calls what does he have?
Good question and the lack of me replying with a bunch of hands we beat is why I xb river. I can see hands like KJ and timid baby flushes turning up.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-15-2018 , 09:40 AM
I usually make it 20 in your spot. I think 25 pre is better. Definite check back river. You could be up against a low flush.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-15-2018 , 09:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
I rather xb flop TBH and then bet turn if another heart doesn't roll off.
I felt like checking behind against four opponents was just giving up.
Giving four players a free card is usually forfeiting the pot.

If we are thinking about players having a single heart and being on a Flush Draw, then isn't it best to value bet those hands?
Giving up after the 4th heart lands seems to make more sense than giving up now.
And I don't think it costs us more money overall. Because if we check behind on the flop, aren't we then forced to call the majority of non-heart turns?
I find that a bet usually gains me more information and thus makes future decisions simpler.

Example:
Will JT call my flop bet without a heart? If someone has a hand like this, don't I want to bet? The pot is already large. Allowing them to outdraw me with 2Pair when they would have folded the flop would be painful.

Checking the flop just seems too weak/scared. And it leaves me clueless on what to do on the turn.

-cm
AA vs 4 opponents Quote
07-16-2018 , 05:55 AM
This flop is pretty brutal. We do not have a real equity edge here. I guess if our plan is to fire one street and then pretty much give up if we get called that's do-able.

I prefer the flop check because I'm not wanting to bloat the pot. I'm certainly not betting for information - we bet because we want to bet, information is a side benefit. Note we get information when we check and then observe what happens when 4 other players act and that didn't cost us anything.

Plug this hand into an equity calculator, see that we're not in good shape here and see what happens to our equity when we get called.

Last edited by WereBeer; 07-16-2018 at 06:00 AM.
AA vs 4 opponents Quote

      
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