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Old 04-13-2014, 05:10 AM   #1
mr_wiggles
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Heart AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

Hey all. This was one of those hands that made me realize I still have a **** ton to learn about this game. It was a doozy to say the least. The game is ridiculously deep and most players are sitting on $1500+. I'm very confident in my play at 1/3 but I was clearly out of my comfort zone in this hand. Be prepared to cringe at the massive amount of mistakes I make.

Hero: Sat down with $500 a few orbits earlier and ran it up to $1350. Initially doubled up through villain with AA and built from there. Mid 20s, white kid, table probably sees me as standard young guy. Not getting too out of line so far.

Villain: Known by the regulars as a maniac. He buys in for $1500 and won't fold pre with anything playable. I don't know if he's a regular because he makes consistent money at 2/5 or if he's just spending daddy's money. He plays too loose but is clearly comfortable playing for stacks at these stakes.

MP raises to $15, V calls, MP and BTN call and I bump it to $85 from the SB with AA.
This might be mistake #1. Maybe make it as big as $120?

Villain calls and BTN calls. Pot $290

Flop TT8 and I panic. Again, I don't know how to play overpairs deep and the fish came out. I ended up checking (mistake #2) because I felt this villain would just raise ATC and exploit me. Obv not great reasoning but that was my logic at the time. V bets $200, BTN folds and I call.

Turn 6
Now I'm against a villain who's range I cannot define in the slightest, I have one pair, and almost 1k behind. So...
  • What is my line ott had I bet $200 otf and been called?
  • What about as played?
  • What if I get raised on either street?

I have no idea how not to get exploited on flops like this. HELP ME

PS I'll post spoilers on the rest of the hand after some discussion
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:37 AM   #2
de4df1sh
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

I think the pre isnt terrible, you may want to bump it up a little more to account for playing the hand OOP.

On the flop I think we should be leading almost any board.

On this particular flop Im looking to bet about 1/2-2/3 pot.

Typically after getting action on this flop im looking to get to showdown. I may bet/fold some red turn cards like kd/kh/ or 2-5 of d or h.

May question to you is, would you have posted this hand if this was 10c/20c?
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Old 04-13-2014, 06:25 AM   #3
a12
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

Imho, pre flop is fine.
On that flop i would lead 150 and see what action to take based off of that.

If i bet 200 get called, on that turn i am checking (folding/calling depends on V. In a vacuum. Folding)
AP: check.
If i get raised, i try to ask myself "why is this Villain raising?" and take it from there. Sometimes i have a wrong read sometimes its right but either way make a plan and stick with it. Be fearless and GL.
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Old 04-13-2014, 11:08 AM   #4
iraisetoomuch
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Pre is fine. Sizing seems decent.

If you think they will call more pre, then raise more pre.

Flop, lead $185 or so.
There's lots of value to be had from JJ - KK, XX, straight draws.

If we bet the flop, check the turn.
If we check the flop, check the turn.

If we are expecting to get raised on the flop, that is fine, we can still bet, we just need to only be betting the stronger part of our range, and expect to call or reraise depending on the villain.
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Old 04-13-2014, 11:17 AM   #5
venice10
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

Pf is good. I'd bet a bit more because everyone is so deep and going to $100 won't discourage anyone.

Bet the flop, especially if you are going to call $200 anyway. Nobody has told you that you are beat.
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Old 04-13-2014, 11:25 AM   #6
Raeed561
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

i lead out on the flop for 175 and try to pot control from there villains range is really wide cause hes a maniac, if you cant range him and know hes going to continue firing i would just fold on the flop so you not in these kinds of predicaments.
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Old 04-13-2014, 11:56 AM   #7
dunderstron!
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There are certain maniacs who are totally predictable. They will bet & barrel ATC when checked to no matter what. Not all maniacs are like this, but if this guy is, my plan would be to become a calling station. Check/call every street and get three streets if value most of the time, or get owned occasionally.

If he's a more "normal" maniac then I like your line so far. If the turn checks through I'm bet/folding blank rivers; check/calling rivers that bring in straights. If a 4th flush card comes I'm checking/evaluating. It's not a good clarkmeister spot because no way he's folding anything better than what we have.
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:02 PM   #8
Garick
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

Interesting hand.

Decision point 1: Continuing to play when you are deep at a new stake. If you're not comfortable, get up.

Decision point 2: Pre-flop. I like it Sizing is good here, imo. Much more completely telegraphs your hand and much less makes IOs too good for the Vs.

Decision point 3: Flop-check. I don't like the check. You're basically saying "I'm scared, please take the pot away from me." Now you have no idea where you are and have surrendered initiative. I much prefer a flop c-bet of about 2/3 pot.

Decision point 4: Flop-call: V's bet could mean anything, and we basically have to fold here or commit to stationing down almost all run-outs.

Decision point 5: AP, don't compound your mistake. This is a bad card for us, as a lot of V's range OTF is Tx and XsXs. V is known to be willing to stack off light, so we really have no ability to turn our hand into a bluff. Just c/f, imo.

If we had led flop and been called, I'd prob b/f this card for about 1/2 pot. If we'd led flop and been raised, I would have folded flop, so this card is irrelevant.
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:12 PM   #9
gus1112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_wiggles View Post
Hey all. This was one of those hands that made me realize I still have a **** ton to learn about this game. It was a doozy to say the least. The game is ridiculously deep and most players are sitting on $1500+. I'm very confident in my play at 1/3 but I was clearly out of my comfort zone in this hand. Be prepared to cringe at the massive amount of mistakes I make.

Hero: Sat down with $500 a few orbits earlier and ran it up to $1350. Initially doubled up through villain with AA and built from there. Mid 20s, white kid, table probably sees me as standard young guy. Not getting too out of line so far.

Villain: Known by the regulars as a maniac. He buys in for $1500 and won't fold pre with anything playable. I don't know if he's a regular because he makes consistent money at 2/5 or if he's just spending daddy's money. He plays too loose but is clearly comfortable playing for stacks at these stakes.

MP raises to $15, V calls, MP and BTN call and I bump it to $85 from the SB with AA.
This might be mistake #1. Maybe make it as big as $120?

Villain calls and BTN calls. Pot $290

Flop TT8 and I panic. Again, I don't know how to play overpairs deep and the fish came out. I ended up checking (mistake #2) because I felt this villain would just raise ATC and exploit me. Obv not great reasoning but that was my logic at the time. V bets $200, BTN folds and I call.

Turn 6
Now I'm against a villain who's range I cannot define in the slightest, I have one pair, and almost 1k behind. So...
  • What is my line ott had I bet $200 otf and been called?
  • What about as played?
  • What if I get raised on either street?

I have no idea how not to get exploited on flops like this. HELP ME

PS I'll post spoilers on the rest of the hand after some discussion
Grunch... I prefer betting flop, but as played I am making it 550 once he bets 200 and calling it off if he shoves

I rely doubt he is making it 200 w a 10 or 88... Board is super drawy so we are about to rude the variance train



As played I probably check turn and fold to a big bet...

But yeah, I can actually see a case for checking flop but when he bets 200 I am check raising and playing for stacks
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:43 PM   #10
Lapidator
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Re: AA OOP 3 way 250bbs deep at aria... recipe for disaster

Tough spot because its a 3b pre pot. You are probably pretty far ahead of Villain's range, but are not likely to win much more $$$ from hands you beat.

I think you can b/f the flop, but after that, the pot's going to be too big to fold no matter what.

So, I would have b/f $175 here OTF. The pot would have been $640 OTT with about $1000 left in stacks. OTT, you have to decide if you're ever folding in this hand. And I probably puke-fold if there are any bets given the crappy turn card.

As played, c/f the turn.

Sometimes you just get a bad board to go along with your rockets. When you're almost 300bb deep, you best be able to let them go.
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