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A9o 7 handed interesting spot A9o 7 handed interesting spot

10-02-2015 , 12:30 PM
1-2 we are playing seven handed

Hero - $300 tag image only shown down decent hands thus far, most of the table is so bad anyways so it's not like they are really ranging me but either way I'm viewed as decent player.

Villain - MAWG $175 pretty bad level 1 thinker, has general understanding of tag strategy you could say, for ex: he will raise pre with AJ + 99+ and call raises with the same plus pocket pairs, suited connectors or even Ax Kx suited ****. Seen him play pretty aggressive post flop, especially after being initial raiser. Limps wide range pre though and overall pretty bad.

OTTH...

Two limpers, folds around to hero in cutoff with Ad9c, who makes it $14
Villain calls in bb everyone else folds.

Flop ($30 ish) 8d 4s 2d
Villain checks, hero bets $25, villain quickly check calls.

Turn ($80) 8d 4s 2d 5h
Villain checks, hero bets $50, villain check raises all in for $85 more.

Very interesting scenario I have to call $85 to win $270 which is slightly over 3-1 odds. I bet flop because although I may have best hand I don't mind to take it down, plus there are a lot of good turn cards for me to barrel ( any T J Q K obviously A or 9 or any diamond). I decided to bet turn (wish I made it sightly smaller 40 or 45 just because of his stack size...I want good size river shove behind ohh well) because he may fold 8x hands and 77 66 33 and his diamond draws. At 1-2 at least at foxwoods, a $50 dollar bet looks strong and big even though in actuality it's only 5/8 pot size. I can triple barrel any 6 7 J Q or K on river which puts him in tough spot and a 3 A or even 9 probably gives me best hand (A or 9 up for debate).

However, getting 3-1 one for $85 more wit just ace high looks nasty but what is villains range?
There are about twenty combos of flush draws that I beat, there are about 8 pair plus flush draw combos that have me beat and I only have 10-15%equity against, and then the rest of his range is 8x, pocket pairs, or sets 88 44 22 55, or 6d7d - which would really suck lol. He can't really have two pair on 8425 board except for maybe 4d5d but that's it.
Because he check-called the flop super quick, I really weighted his range heavily towards having a flush draw. I think he at least takes a little more time before c/c ing on the flop if he has 8x, 4x, or something like 77 66 55 or even 99 TT JJ. Also, if he had a set I don't think he insta check calls I think he would again take a little more time to c/c and some percentage of the time he might even c/r flop with a set. Important to note also, we have the A of diamonds, so he therefore cant be bluffing with a better ace high ex: AJdd.

Thoughts on calling versus folding given villains range and my physical read of his quick check call on flop?
A9o 7 handed interesting spot Quote
10-02-2015 , 12:38 PM
fold
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10-02-2015 , 12:46 PM
you are not going to be good in this spot one time in 4. So far you don't even have a hand yet. If you river an ace you are still very likely behind. I don't think he has a FD, most level 1 thinkers are flatting there imo.

fold ainec at all
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10-02-2015 , 01:34 PM
Fold pre, flop bet is fine, c/f turn. Sorry OP, but having nothing and no real draw facing an all-in raise is not very interesting.
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10-02-2015 , 01:36 PM
I don't like the sizing whatsoever on flop nor turn, your plan to save for river barrel is fruitless (he'll just fold draws and still call pairs that called you twice already a lot), and you're leaving out some hands a bad player will call flop with that play turn this way (85, A3, A8, maybe 35). I still think his SD type hands ck-c and his FDs do too, so ck-r is value a good amount of the time. You're losing to all but a naked FD and 79o right now anyways... AP fold. Turn size larger if you have to bluff, but I'd rather just get to SD as cheaply as possible once he called PSB on flop.
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10-02-2015 , 01:41 PM
I don't understand the turn bet a little bit.
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10-02-2015 , 02:17 PM
Normally it's a snap fold, this is always a value line. However, I had seen this v play pretty aggressive and take this same line with a draw before. I'm not saying he has a draw here every time but getting 3 to 1 if I feel he has a draw say 50% of the time can we profitably call? I think my original description of v may have been misleading. Basically I expected him to turn over a diamond draw way more often then 8x or a pair or better hand. He was loose pre but 85 suited is borderline for him to call a 14 dollar raise with. Also, I don't think he snap calls the flop with that but rather takes a little more time and then calls. The only thing that sucks is he could have some 4x or 5x diamond draws.
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10-03-2015 , 12:58 PM
Pre: meh. Depends on the table.
Flop: love it
Turn: if he's the sort of guy who will play any two suited cards, and we figure most of his flop calling range is fd's, then I like the turn bet. But not because he folds his fd's, sheesh. You want him to call. If he's even remotely TAGgish, turn is a c/f. And he is, so it is. Don't even think about calling the c/r.
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10-03-2015 , 01:11 PM
Preflop: fold. Or bigger. Given the limpers, I'd probably go $17. Or fold.
Flop: c bet is ok. You have the Ad which gives you two overs and a back door flush draw. If he has any piece, he's calling though.
Turn: this is an easy check behind. Given that H has the Ad, that reduces the chance of him being on a flush draw a lot. He may have called any Axs preflop, but is he calling all Kxs, Qxs, etc? V has a handy he doesn't believe you have an over pairs and he's calling your down. Check turn.
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10-03-2015 , 04:28 PM
V folds a lot of turn hands that are beating me. "I don't understand turn bet at all" - he folds 8x hands a lot he's dumb and the normal turn bet at this particular table was 30 35 ish cuz these people are bad. This guy would fold a lot of single pair hands to $50 dollars. That is why I bet the turn. Also I don't mind if he calls or folds his flush draws im indifferent to that. When he shoved my first reaction was easy fold. But when I thought about the hand for a little bit I realized this guy is spazzy, he's played his drawing hands like this before and I felt more often then not he's going to show me QT of diamonds or something of that nature.
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10-03-2015 , 04:33 PM
I called and v showed j9 of diamonds...everyone's so quick to say this is always a value line ur not good here 1 in 4 times... I did bad job of describing villain initially, he understands general strategy but he is not tag, he is bad and I've seen him spazz out, I guess I should have mentioned that I saw him take c/c c/shove line with a draw before but ohh well fulkkkk me
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10-03-2015 , 05:30 PM
sick play bro
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10-03-2015 , 05:46 PM
Thanks bro wanna fight lol
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10-03-2015 , 05:55 PM
Well ok this illustrates the value of playing Ax aggressively against some villains. Against a loose passive fish, where you are pretty sure he is on a fd, ace high is often enough to charge him and if you watch your kicker there's potential for modest improvement that be helpful. Tell ya though there's a world of difference between Ax and Ax suited, didn't used to believe that but I have become a believer. I still think you have to be careful of the c/r especially when stacks are short. You and me, when we c/r the flop it's always a bluff. The fish don't look at it the same way. They do understand on a certain level why it's bad to bluff c/r when stacks are short. They are capable of perceiving that you might not be able to get away from your hand. To be fair this villain probably wasn't thinking in terms of effective stack size. As you mentioned he was probably thinking about leverage in terms of absolute bet size.

Anyway nice hand. You put your hand reading skills and player profiling skills to good use. Keep posting hands and if you have an in depth read definitely share it

Last edited by AbqDave; 10-03-2015 at 06:01 PM.
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