There are different ways to beat LLSNL. The job is to find spots where we can call expand our thought processes to make the most money. I don't doubt that the majority of you can beat 1/2 NL. It's pretty easy to do. The goal is to increase your WR by finding spots such as this.

As I have said, I don't take elaborate bluff lines like this often and I play pretty standard besides the few spots I take such as this.

Why is this unbalanced? I am bombing flop with my value hands for sure. The Ah as well.

I don't hate the play in a vacuum. I hate the play against a player you have zero history against. That's mine, slim's and others' point: you took a high variance line against a player who you have no clue about.

It worked out - this time. You're leveling yourself if you think this is a good play against most unknowns.

Shove pre imo

What was the high variance part about this line besides flop and why were those parts high variance?

You see people? THIS is what we need. Thank you. I'll ship pre next time.

Really? If you had, say the Th you wouldn't just check back this river? How many hands do you have in your range at this point that hold the Jh, based on preflop, flop and turn action? And when you do have the Ah, how much value do you think you're getting on the river/flop when taking this line against an unknown villain?

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You specifically mentioned the flop. Also, I have the Ah in my range for sure and his range is weak OTT and OTR and he is almost never calling on a river heart. This thread has already concluded that shipping river as played is the best decision, by the way. Please read through. Even if he had a J in his hand, our bluff is working 75% of the time that he doesn't have the Jh and we don't need nearly that much for this ship to be +EV OTR.

I don't understand how a play is high variance when it is going to work the vast majority of the time. Please explain which parts were high variance and why. Specifying opponent's ranges for those spots that you believe to be true would help here.

No.

Quality input. Glad to have you. Welcome to 2+2. Apparently you should fit in just fine.

Again if you are so confident that this was working wtf are you creating this thread?

OK, so we're narrowing this down.

Pre - meh.

Flop, ok, we can argue, though I am coming to believe more and more that monotone flops are great to cbet. People git scurred of those flops.

Turn. This is the crux. By V not leading flop, not c/r flop and leading turn small, can we say V is weak? If yes, is it better to raise turn, or call and bomb river? OP made a good arg for bombing river instead of raising turn. V may have straight draws, etc, that cause him to call turn, but not river. Slim and others argue that calling turn is spew, cuz V too likely to call and/or lead river.

My conclusion: This is a read/image problem. We must know whether V has a fold button. I think OP knows V's age, how V handled chips, whether V looks like a total tourist versus a rec player who knows how to fold. Give us those facts, and we decide better.

Yep, my first post in this thread concluded the exact same thing. Shoving is the best play when at the river, only as damage control from your spew on the turn though. Calm it down, you seem to be getting silly and defensive.

You don't have any history with the fella, so you don't have a good depiction of his range on the flop or turn. All you have is ranges based on general tendencies of other people at your stake. Fair enough if you think that's good enough to stack off on. It's something I personally don't recommend.

I think he only needs to be good like 33% of the time on this river. We don't know this villain, but I would personally cry-call this with Jh 100%. But hey ho, that's probably cause I'm terrible at poker as well.

Should I not create threads about interesting hands that I played? Only hands that I have questions about? Am I missing the point of this poker forum?

This forum is so players can talk about hands as well. It's not a Q&A forum.

V was actually as average as you can get. Middle aged dude paying attention to the hand, but not doing anything fancy. He wasn't handling chips between decisions but he seemed to count them out well when calling and betting. No timing tells.

It's hard to argue points on this forum without sounding defensive, but I am not being defensive or else I wouldn't be here. I am open to good input for sure.

Sizing is a major factor here that I don't think you are taking into consideration.

Also, he has the Jh such a small amount of the time here. I'm not trying to get him to fold the Jh. If he x/c flop, led turn small, then checked river with the Jh then good for him. I don't think he takes this line with that card though. Do you?

Even if he does have a Jack in his hand, he still has all his Jacks in his range by the river and he will only have the Jh 1/4 of the time. Also, he has other bad hands in his range, would you agree?

He's saying it is a high variance line because his opinion is that it will NOT work the majority of the time. Obviously you disagree. I'm just saying what I think he means.

With the Ah as the nut flush blocker I could agree with you and say it could work enough to justify it. Especially against a competent player. BUT, this villain is not only an unknown. He is the nuts, as far as "unknown" goes if you understand what I mean. You know literally nothing about how bad, good, mediocre he is at poker. Which means you could be right, or you could be dead wrong. It could be profitable because he'll fold this really often. He could also be a complete lunatic and call you with deuces. Obviously that's extreme, but you get the point.

I think you have many good arguments to support your play, which regardless of whether it was a good play or not is a good thing to have. But the bottom line that people are trying to get across, villain is completely and utterly, unknown.

Thread has officially gone off the rails. Reminder to all, no trolling strategy threads ITF, even if you think OP is asking for it.

this isn't even close to correct.

many Js are folding to your flop bet, up to JxJx with no heart.

just because a guy may call your flop bet with J7x, doesnt mean he's calling it with J7